Think you've answered your own question already, buddy. You're plan B. You're just in the denial phase. You have to realize that if you settle for that, your desperation will be obvious, and no girl loves a man with no self-respect. Your best chance at getting her back is actually not contacting her again, even if she writes to you. Unless she makes it clear that she wants to be with you and no one else, and regrets stringing you along, you should no longer speak to her. It's also the best thing you can do for yourself.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
She could feel strong about you and still not get enough of what she needs. You should end it and move on.
Also, why the fuck would you spy on her. She made it clear you're not together, but more importantly why would you lurk for information which would give you zero benefit? What Loco said could be true, but there could be about 5 different things that pop into my head that would still make sense, even if she was with someone at that moment. Gratz, you played yourself, now learn and move on.
I'm all for absolute knowledge, but in practice its better to not know some things, otherwise you could put yourself in a situation where you don't sleep normally for months... and for what? Cause your genes gave you high reactivity and you did everything possible to trigger it in a negative manner.
You sound very insecure and not in a way led due to your connection to someone on a deeper level, but in general. You should start learning how to respect yourself first and then worry about everything else.
What Lemon meant by breakups = personal growth is due to his disposition to breakups. You could either let it turn you into a better version of yourself, or allow yourself to dwell into self-destructive actions which will later require even more time to fix. There isn't really a decision to be made between the two...
P.S. I might sound a bit harsh, but thats cause the situation you find yourself in really reminds me of myself a few years back and the path I took and how much time I needed to learn things that seem quite simple and obvious if you're "sober". She might be the best, kindest, smarters person you've ever met, that doesn't change shit. Appreciate what you had and move on. Loco's advice on not contacting her at all is indeed your best chance and its also the most optimal one, whichever way the situation develops in. Case one, you get back together. Case two, you've initiated the recovery period. If she is an admirable person, she will act accordingly in either scenario and either make sure to get back with you or let you go.
I would play it a different way. Treat her like an ex that you want to be amicable with but be somewhat brusque with her in communication. The latter is kind of tricky because ideally you want to be over her and leading an awesome life. The question is what do you do when you've had a bad day and you are eating McDonald's alone in your apartment and get a text from her at 10pm? The no communication play works because you don't do anything stupid. It severs the attachment sooner.
On December 11 2018 03:13 RiKD wrote:
I have 4 suggestions. You can do all four or none.
1.) Go on a bit of a bender or at least some decent debauchery in social venues
2.) Eat some shrooms and go into the forest
3.) Take some MDMA and go to a rave.
4.) Get a new therapist:
a.) Get helped by new therapist
b.) Inevitably fall in love with new therapist
c.) Both
Rofl. I started seeing my old therapist. She accepted seeing me again. All is good though, my feelings for have passed. I prefer option 1. Went to a bar after she broke up with me. Two hours later I got a woman's number, who told me she had a hotel room nearby. She was hot, and also older, but my mind was on the ex. Still haven't called her.
You have to get more drunk. Having sex with that women would most likely be mostly vapid with some good points and some orgasms. For me after orgasm it was always like what do I do now? Mostly smoke cigarettes or joints and it all seemed to work out until it didn't but that's besides the point. We are trying to get this all out of your system. Who knows what will actually happen. You could go back to the hotel room and have great sex and be snapped out of the trance or you could go to the hotel room and feel like nothing is complete like it was with Her. This is an exploration process.
On December 10 2018 21:30 Loco wrote:
"What does she want from me? "
Think you've answered your own question already, buddy. You're plan B. You're just in the denial phase. You have to realize that if you settle for that, your desperation will be obvious, and no girl loves a man with no self-respect. Your best chance at getting her back is actually not contacting her again, even if she writes to you. Unless she makes it clear that she wants to be with you and no one else, and regrets stringing you along, you should no longer speak to her. It's also the best thing you can do for yourself.
Yes I'm probably in denial. Definitely in denial. But her stringing me along and accepting my invitations confuses me. You're right about self-respect. I've been knowingly sacrificing my pride in order to get her back.
Though I'm trying to understand your logic. I understand going no contact. But to not reply to her when she writes me? How is ignoring her going to increase the odds of getting her back. If anything, I feel that I should set up a date if she contacts me.
She has an avoidant attachment style. Whoever she's seeing (likely her ex before me) is only a casual partner. It's how she coping with the breakup. She's afraid of emotional closeness and of commitment. I doubt this other guy has any chance long term. I'm not sure where that leaves me in her plan.
It's very simple. Keep this mantra in mind, write it down if you must. "Don't make someone a priority when they only see you as an option."
This person has broken up with you. This means that they do not currently see a future with you. Anything that doesn't precisely say that they were wrong in doing so is what we call "breadcrumbs". It's testing the waters, seeing how much respect you have for yourself. How much power she (still) has over you. Typically, when they write to you after breaking up with you, it is to assuage their own guilt, or to keep you as a back up. If you are weak and you show that you are still interested in merely breadcrumbs, they will not be interested in having a serious relationship with you.
If they still have you as an option, they'll either use it when they feel lonely and bored, and you will hate yourself for it, or they'll simply become distant again, ghost you, or give you cold responses. Either way, you will always be reminded of what you lost. You should read all of the reasons to go no contact here. It's not easy, it's a long process for many, and progress is not linear, but the sooner you are able to stick to it, the better off you will be.
She has an avoidant attachment style.
Knowing her attachment style is something that might have had relevance when you were still with this person. You are not anymore. Also keep in mind that you might not know her as well as you think you do and she might have a more serious personality disorder. If she cannot be alone, she could have BPD. She is obviously quite immature, breaking up by text (something that's typical BPD). You've even used the word 'discarded' here which is the word victims of those with BPD/NPD use all the time. Fear of engulfment (closeness) is also a hallmark of BPD. If she does have undiagnosed BPD then I can help you as I have a lot of knowledge and experience with it. You should read this article and look up the diagnostic criteria.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
for fucks sake... she manipulates you to keep you as a safety net and you beg her and grovel to a girl who is fucking another guy... both of you are toxic.
Its over, get that into your head, and its actually a great thing, you dont have to waste any more time with a woman who cleary isn't someone you want to spend the rest of your life with, move on, work on yourself so you stop doing creepy shit like rolling past their house at 1am and find a better girl, get a hold of yourself
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Last edit: 11/12/2018 09:40
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K40Cheddar United States. Dec 11 2018 08:04. Posts 2202
Also yes brake ups should make you grow up and become a better person, we are forged through trials and tribulations and each hit of the hammer is painful, so dont run away from this, embrace it or you will become either soft and frail or hard and resentful.
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1
moonk379 United States. Dec 11 2018 12:52. Posts 355
Just dont text or talk to her for a week. If she is still interested in any way, she will text you. And also deny meeting if she does text. Will make her thjnk more. If not then just move on.
On December 10 2018 21:30 Loco wrote:
"What does she want from me? "
Think you've answered your own question already, buddy. You're plan B. You're just in the denial phase. You have to realize that if you settle for that, your desperation will be obvious, and no girl loves a man with no self-respect. Your best chance at getting her back is actually not contacting her again, even if she writes to you. Unless she makes it clear that she wants to be with you and no one else, and regrets stringing you along, you should no longer speak to her. It's also the best thing you can do for yourself.
Yes I'm probably in denial. Definitely in denial. But her stringing me along and accepting my invitations confuses me. You're right about self-respect. I've been knowingly sacrificing my pride in order to get her back.
Though I'm trying to understand your logic. I understand going no contact. But to not reply to her when she writes me? How is ignoring her going to increase the odds of getting her back. If anything, I feel that I should set up a date if she contacts me.
She has an avoidant attachment style. Whoever she's seeing (likely her ex before me) is only a casual partner. It's how she coping with the breakup. She's afraid of emotional closeness and of commitment. I doubt this other guy has any chance long term. I'm not sure where that leaves me in her plan.
It's very simple. Keep this mantra in mind, write it down if you must. "Don't make someone a priority when they only see you as an option."
This person has broken up with you. This means that they do not currently see a future with you. Anything that doesn't precisely say that they were wrong in doing so is what we call "breadcrumbs". It's testing the waters, seeing how much respect you have for yourself. How much power she (still) has over you. Typically, when they write to you after breaking up with you, it is to assuage their own guilt, or to keep you as a back up. If you are weak and you show that you are still interested in merely breadcrumbs, they will not be interested in having a serious relationship with you.
If they still have you as an option, they'll either use it when they feel lonely and bored, and you will hate yourself for it, or they'll simply become distant again, ghost you, or give you cold responses. Either way, you will always be reminded of what you lost. You should read all of the reasons to go no contact here. It's not easy, it's a long process for many, and progress is not linear, but the sooner you are able to stick to it, the better off you will be.
She has an avoidant attachment style.
Knowing her attachment style is something that might have had relevance when you were still with this person. You are not anymore. Also keep in mind that you might not know her as well as you think you do and she might have a more serious personality disorder. If she cannot be alone, she could have BPD. She is obviously quite immature, breaking up by text (something that's typical BPD). You've even used the word 'discarded' here which is the word victims of those with BPD/NPD use all the time. Fear of engulfment (closeness) is also a hallmark of BPD. If she does have undiagnosed BPD then I can help you as I have a lot of knowledge and experience with it. You should read this article and look up the diagnostic criteria.
Okay. I read through the reasons for no contact. Makes sense. I'll go no contact up to a certain point, because I would like to still get back together. It's not like we ended on bad terms. When I look back at the relationship there were very few bad moments. I'm not sure if her actions qualify as breadcrumbs, because I am the one who initiates contact. She's always very responsive and friendly, telling me about her day etc. And she's been accepting my dinner invitations. It's seems like more than breadcrumbs to me.
I'll stop initiating until she shows effort. If she texts me casually I'll respond casually. If she invites me over or out for drinks then I'll accept.
I don't believe she has BFD. She seems sane and is a high functioning person, very impressive woman. She's not emotionally unstable. If anything she's emotionally closed off, afraid of commitment and being vulnerable. When we had serious talks about emotions she would literally squirm in her chair. When I talked to her about being official, she squirmed in her chair,but ultimately agreed. When I discussed my need and wanting to see each other more often the same thing happened. When I'd confess to her at the end of a great weekend how I felt about her, she would in turn distant herself the following week. Really strange behavior. One evening I told her "farewell", then my phone died for a few days. When I got it fixed I received a few voicemails from her where she seemed anxious and asked to see me again. It's the first time she called me ever. She thought my "farewell" was goodbye for good.
At the beginning of our relationship everything was different. She didn't "love bomb" me-- she never used the love word. But she was constantly inviting me over, inviting me out. Always showing affection. Talking of future plans, like moving to a different province and starting anew together. Talking of moving in together and travelling. Now that I look back at all of that there is no way she was serious about any of it. No way that any of it was an actual consideration. All that talk stopped a few months in. I felt baited, though maybe it was unconscious behavior by her. A few months later she admitted that she doesn't like hugs from anyone. She would start asking me to stay on my side of the bed and how she can't sleep if I'm too close, and how she desires a king size bed. Less affection. She told me what I wanted to hear at the beginning. Then when we get close and start falling in love she leaves and blames it on age, when age was never an obstacle before. All very confusing to me.
Does any of this seem like BPD?
Obviously it didn't make sense to you if you're going "no contact up to a certain point". No contact means no contact, period. You're just not ready yet, you don't have the self-respect and the desire to heal. You'll have to suffer more. Limited contact is only an option for people who have children with their ex, not people who are addicted to someone who discarded them. "Just give me an another dose, up to a certain point." Ever hear a junkie successfully quit with such an attitude?
Some confusion about breadcrumbs. What are breadcrumbs? "Basically any contact from the dumper that does not communicate the clear intent of reconciliation. And YES, this includes: “I miss you,” “How are you doing? I care about you and hope you’re doing okay,” “I’m sorry it has to be this way,” “You still mean so much to me,” etc. Nowhere in these texts do they convey the need to start again or work on the relationship. As tempting as it may be to respond in kind (and trust me I ALWAYS speak from experience), what often happens is the dumper backs off in contact again the moment they are aware that you are still willing to get back together with them at a moment’s notice." So yes, you are dealing with them right now.
And you know the worst part of it? It's that by answering to them you are making her other romantic relationships better. Instead of making her feel the weight of losing you, you make her feel better about her decision because you are not forcing her to make a choice! You implicitly say, 'it's okay that you treated me like this - I'm still into you!'. Even though you don't feel this way, your actions are betraying you. She gets the best out of both worlds by using you and she gets to test your limits. You are complementing her current lifestyle; there's no risk for her to sleep with other men, so why the hell would she go back to being exclusive with you?. She knows you're desperate if you're always just one phone call from a few drinks and you're not establishing boundaries with her. And, if she was a good person, she'd know that you are in pain, and that she should stay away rather than give you false hope.
Some confusion about lovebombing. Lovebombing doesn't mean that they are bombing you with the word 'love'. What it means is that they are doing things that demonstrate an unhealthy attachment with someone they haven't known for very long. Making serious plans to move in/marry/have a child with someone after a few weeks or months is often part of it. When you say "there's no way she was serious" this is often what a neurotypical person will think looking back, as they try to make sense of a situation that doesn't make any sense, because the other individual is disordered and doesn't use logic to make their decisions. I'm not saying she has BPD, but if she did, you would have no clue why she does what she does. They are driven by impulsion -- not rational self-interest. They rationalize their impulsive actions instead of using rationality to prevent them.
I would have to know a lot more about her to tell you if it sounds like BPD. Right now, there are some red flags for sure. She could have a few traits (and many borderlines are high functioning). Either way, she's not good for you, and you will never be happy pursuing this person. Even if she wants you back, you'd have to deal with that unpredictability, that ability of hers to blindside you and leave any minute; it would never go away. Realistically, she is almost guaranteed to do it again. She has had those patterns of behavior basically forever, and she is old enough to be less adaptive (the brain becomes less plastic over time, making conscious change more difficult).
This might help you:
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
She's not obliged to you in any way and she's obviously not gonna be interested in you for friend purposes considering all things atm. It really doesn't matter who she spends her nights with, you're not involved. You're crossing borders and going in circles.
She's taking advantage regardless of whether she realizes it or not thus ===> everything else that people said in the thread previously
I can't say I'm surprised at this outcome and how you handled it. I feel like I'm reliving a part of my past when I read your blog. I'm not as articulate as Loco however, so I'll just say that everything he's said so far is right on the money.
On December 11 2018 05:59 Baalim wrote:
for fucks sake... she manipulates you to keep you as a safety net and you beg her and grovel to a girl who is fucking another guy... both of you are toxic.
I'm toxic? No I don't think so. I'm just inexperienced. This is my first real relationship in a decade. How do you expect me to act when finally falling for someone after being alone for so long? And as for her fucking another guy.. well, we're both single now. Rebounds are not uncommon. The only issue I have with that is her concealing it and continuing to go out with me for dinner in a non-friendly way, where she dresses up and greets me with a kiss.
Dont take the word too literally, I didn't mean anything specific with it, Indeed you are inexperienced, most of us have gone through many breakhearts its painful and its natural to cling since we see that as an exit to try to avoid the pain of loss but it doesn't take a genius to know its wrong, it takes objectivity which is very difficult in your situation so you have to find the will power to do it.
I'm not telling you not to be sad or to muscle through your feellings, what I'm saying is to stop pursuing a woman who clearly isn't the love of your life, get away, get well and emotionally stable and then if it turns out she was indeed the right woman then you will be able to get back with her, but you are not in the position to judge that, just take the hit, suffer what must be suffered and move on.
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United States. Dec 11 2018 04:13. Posts 9041
