Happy Holidays Mother Fuckers

so change jobs

UBI is cancer

On December 28 2019 08:47 Zografa wrote: UBI is cancer

Why?

On December 28 2019 07:57 Santafairy wrote: so change jobs

Easier said than done.

that's because either your job now is shit making you not believe in yourself or you would just hate anything no matter where you are

if you can physically go to and do it without getting mentally or physically ill count your blessingr

Ooh poor wage slave can just barely support himself enough to have a vacation when half the world is in the shitter

two jobs didn't pay me and now broke

I was memeing before but now I'm being serious - the world's not over just because you don't have a disposable income for ridiculous lamps right now

Whole planet needs to fucking grow up

On December 28 2019 18:17 RiKD wrote: Show nested quote + On December 28 2019 08:47 Zografa wrote: UBI is cancer Why?

If you have to ask you just need to read more about it. It is just bad idea, and there is data already about it.

On December 28 2019 04:37 RiKD wrote: I just feel depressed. My life felt so free on vacation. There was rarely downtime. Now I'm back to this shit.

It's mostly mental tbh... You can play videogames and be bored out of your damn mind; you can engage in mundane chores and be on cloud9..

You gotta find a way to feel free IN what you do... your state of spirit is the 1st problem imo

On December 29 2019 18:00 Zografa wrote: Show nested quote + On December 28 2019 18:17 RiKD wrote:   On December 28 2019 08:47 Zografa wrote: UBI is cancer Why? If you have to ask you just need to read more about it. It is just bad idea, and there is data already about it.

On the whole it would be bad unless there was some huge awakening of consciousness where people would be more responsible with all that free money being handed to them.. but then again, handouts wouldn't be much of a thing in a collectively risen state...

happy holidays

On December 28 2019 18:37 Santafairy wrote: that's because either your job now is shit making you not believe in yourself or you would just hate anything no matter where you are if you can physically go to and do it without getting mentally or physically ill count your blessingr Ooh poor wage slave can just barely support himself enough to have a vacation when half the world is in the shitter two jobs didn't pay me and now broke I was memeing before but now I'm being serious - the world's not over just because you don't have a disposable income for ridiculous lamps right now Whole planet needs to fucking grow up

There is some aspect of it in not believing in myself. I think part of it is my current job is a real struggle. I have a co-worker that was talking about how it's like giving a pint of blood every shift. I physically can't even do what's required ie having everything prepped and ready and finished by 10:30am to open up the shop. I can't do x, y, z, or make pizzas fast enough. What used to be a 2 person job is now a 1 person job in mornings and at night. That's a big jump.

It's a possibility I might hate what I am doing wherever I am at. I could see some things being more tolerable. I could see some things being less tolerable. I'm supposed to be happy about being a wage slave slaving a large portion of my life away just so I can eat and attempt to pay absurd hospital bills that are depressing to think about.

I experience a lot of stress and anxiety regarding the current job. It's not fun man.

It's not about a disposable income for lamps. I will likely go down in income for my next job. Most of the time I don't crave more. Yeah, it would be nice to do this or that or have this or that but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter. I want to be able to afford art classes and supplies. I want to be able to have some vegan Thai food instead of Chick-Fil-A. There is like this perma-dread surrounding the state of my car. And there is a perma-dread for how my day might go at work which is exhausting.

On December 29 2019 18:00 Zografa wrote: Show nested quote + On December 28 2019 18:17 RiKD wrote:   On December 28 2019 08:47 Zografa wrote: UBI is cancer Why? If you have to ask you just need to read more about it. It is just bad idea, and there is data already about it.

The data I've seen is pretty positive. Your answer seems pretty lazy. Maybe I'll read more and maybe I won't but most things that I have read have shown that UBI has potential. The only downside it seems is that it would perhaps keep capitalism going longer.

On December 29 2019 21:11 froboy12342 wrote: Show nested quote + On December 28 2019 04:37 RiKD wrote: I just feel depressed. My life felt so free on vacation. There was rarely downtime. Now I'm back to this shit. It's mostly mental tbh... You can play videogames and be bored out of your damn mind; you can engage in mundane chores and be on cloud9.. You gotta find a way to feel free IN what you do... your state of spirit is the 1st problem imo

I do my best to get into pizza making flow states and it may get me by and the time might fly when I am slammed with orders but it's disingenuous to try to mask the activity as something that can be spiritual in nature. I have to do the same thing over and over again for x hours a week and that is just hard to do.

On December 29 2019 21:17 froboy12342 wrote: Show nested quote + On December 29 2019 18:00 Zografa wrote:   On December 28 2019 18:17 RiKD wrote:   On December 28 2019 08:47 Zografa wrote: UBI is cancer Why? If you have to ask you just need to read more about it. It is just bad idea, and there is data already about it. On the whole it would be bad unless there was some huge awakening of consciousness where people would be more responsible with all that free money being handed to them.. but then again, handouts wouldn't be much of a thing in a collectively risen state...

In test runs people spend the money on things like food and bills. Sure, some might subsidize a drug habit or something or go out and buy some purse that they think will make them feel better but ok ce la vie.

On December 29 2019 21:56 dnagardi wrote: happy holidays

Muh man dnagardi

I don't think the UBI makes much sense as a policy for different reasons than those posted, it is less efficient to a targeted welfare system that takes care of people's specific needs. Why should a single person get the same as a single parent with 3 kids? Well, it all depends on how it's implemented, it can overlap a welfare system but it really makes little sense. The UBI has a lot of appeal because of it's simplicity and its reduction in a small amount of beuracracy, but simplistic solutions are not suitable for a society where people have different needs and wants, and there are plenty of very strong other policies that are much better imo.

part of The UBI's motivation is the completely unsubstantiated world view that robots are about to automate a huge part of the economy, even though there are many jobs that the american economy needs, like more teachers, investment in public transport is seriously needed, and investment in the green economy is seriously needed. Potential Jobs in the green economy are estimated to be around four times that in the fossil fuel sector. Simply implementing a max 6 hour work day would probably end the long term cyclical unemployment that has resulted in real wage stagation since the 1970's. The minimum wage would roughly be 2-3 times higher than it is right now if neoliberalism hadn't happened. Similarly the trade deficit can largely be eliminated through devualing the dollar by 10-20%, and this would bring back a lot of manufacturing jobs. A lot of claims i just made here, can go into depth on all of them.

work is complete druggery if your a cog in the system, paid little and it's uninteresting. One major fix would be to simply implement socialism: democratric control over the workplace. Of course, this idea is ridiculed, always with weak arguments imo.

simply implement socialism

On December 30 2019 11:43 Stroggoz wrote: I don't think the UBI makes much sense as a policy for different reasons than those posted, it is less efficient to a targeted welfare system that takes care of people's specific needs. Why should a single person get the same as a single parent with 3 kids? Well, it all depends on how it's implemented, it can overlap a welfare system but it really makes little sense. The UBI has a lot of appeal because of it's simplicity and its reduction in a small amount of beuracracy, but simplistic solutions are not suitable for a society where people have different needs and wants, and there are plenty of very strong other policies that are much better imo. part of The UBI's motivation is the completely unsubstantiated world view that robots are about to automate a huge part of the economy, even though there are many jobs that the american economy needs, like more teachers, investment in public transport is seriously needed, and investment in the green economy is seriously needed. Potential Jobs in the green economy are estimated to be around four times that in the fossil fuel sector. Simply implementing a max 6 hour work day would probably end the long term cyclical unemployment that has resulted in real wage stagation since the 1970's. The minimum wage would roughly be 2-3 times higher than it is right now if neoliberalism hadn't happened. Similarly the trade deficit can largely be eliminated through devualing the dollar by 10-20%, and this would bring back a lot of manufacturing jobs. A lot of claims i just made here, can go into depth on all of them. work is complete druggery if your a cog in the system, paid little and it's uninteresting. One major fix would be to simply implement socialism: democratric control over the workplace. Of course, this idea is ridiculed, always with weak arguments imo.

Why should we not look to automate everything as fast as possible? The faster we get to zero marginal cost the better. We can bring manufacturing back locally. We won't have to outsource to Indonesia or China. The problem is when the corporations get all of that money and people are just out of work.

i'm not saying we shouldn't automate society, i agree that it is a good thing and allows people to do more interesting work than the mundane stuff, and i also agree the benefits are not distributed fairly, and the way it's done causes unemployment and wage stagnation, as anyone who's seen the graph on productivity gains and wage increases over time has noticed. Human beings have infinite creativty, even if you lock them in solitary confinement they can create language and math games in their head that are boundless. So there are two things to say about that; it's possible to implement an economic system where anyone that wants to work can, since work is an expression of creativity. secondly, does society want such an economic system?

As far as i know the only "real" experiment with UBI was in Finland and it failed. And Finland is one of the most social countries in the world with one of the better education systems.

Im telling you - socialism(what democrats are preaching nowadays) is bad for you as a person coming from a country where this was reality for quite a while and 30 years after it ended we still suffer the consequences.

You are proposing the idea that UBI is good so burden of proof lies in your hands, im just skeptical and the data so far is controversial at best.