need advice @ nl 25

u need to have a reason to 3bet with pp, aj+, and kq. cant just be 3betting with those hands in any position.

1 and 3 are the same

in conclusion, play abc poker. in all honesty, i wouldn't even play lag at nl25, i'd just play like 15 tables and nit it up hardcore.

and get paid off all the time, cuz well, it's nl25

in fact, i'd probably even do that until nl100, in which case i wouldn't nit it up hardcore, i'd just nit it up.

imo, nl200 is where you gotta start fucking around a bit

so yes, just put in a lot of volume, nit it up, value bet, and rape some ponies

rape the fucking ponies man, rape them hard, and rape them rough

EDIT: editing key points of opening post while asking for advice is generally a horrible idea

3betting all pocket pairs, AJ+ and KQ as a standard is pretty bad imo.

Don't learn poker at NL25, you'll get owned by the rake. Move up as far as you can before you start loosening up or settling down at a limit.

always have reasons for doing things!

learn to value bet and position

On June 22 2009 00:05 Seobombisgay wrote: u need to have a reason to 3bet with pp, aj+, and kq. cant just be 3betting with those hands in any position.

well in my experience people fold to 3 bet with anything less than AA KK AK, and only call with QQ JJ. it was just an attempt to really open my game and learn something. lately i just want to learn as much as possible about the game, but i feel like the only thing u can learn here is how to v-bet and c-bet.

i think dragon has the right idea, i think nl 25 can be summarized as just playing through with sheer endurance and will. meh but it's becoming such a drag, just playing on auto pilot. it's no longer mentally stimulating but i guess i'll complain when i get to 1/2

basically 3 kinds of hands preflop

in general,

3bet hands with value pre and post, meaning you get value when called and it's likely to continue as the best hand postflop: obviously premium hands (range gets wider as villain gets more and more loose)
3bet or fold hands with no value pre or post (because you can't play big pots and win long term with them): K4s, A2o, rags, even hands like QJo AJo depending on villain and position
call with hands that have good postflop value: TT, 89s, 22
,
the MOST important thing that you have to remember that this is all subject to the range of hands villain is playing

if villain is raise/calling 89s 66 preflop, then you obviously want to raise more broadway cards and higher pocket pairs for value preflop
if villain is extremely tight and will fold all dominated hands to a 3bet and raise the rest of his range, you want to flat hands like JJ or AQ and play postflop, while polarizing your 3bets to premiums and rags that you snapfold when raised (instead of going uhhh... i have JJ and he 4bet me wtf do i do?)

that idea kind of applies to postflop play as well

if your hand has good showdown value, don't turn it into a bluff by betting or raising when it folds out everything you beat and get only called by better hands.

you'll generally want to make your bluffs when you lack showdown value.

mang..... u guy's have the wrong idea -_-

i can beat nl 25 playing nitty...and i can also beat nl 25 playing lag (raising all pp, AJ+, KQ, playing position)
playing lag was an experiment by me for me, to see if i can beat nl 25 at a better winning rate. aka outplaying opponents alot more than playing abc poker. alot of thought went into this but it seemed to be just on par with playing nitty.

i just wanted to check with other members who have also beat nl25 and was wondering if playing nitty and going for sheer number of hands was more profitable. it seems like the general consensus is to just play nitty and just maximize hand numbers.


anyway u bring up a good point college about raising with hands that don't have much pre or post flop value. Why is this? i do this on occasion as well, raising qj, Ax (in the blinds more often actually) why do we do this? i mean when i do it i expect to pick up the pot like 80% of the time, but i never really understood why we did it with these hands, vs any other random hand or random moment. it just seems like an occasional bluff to pick up an occasional pot without resistance.

Hi Jas

I believe you're missing the point .

Most of the people ( and i do say MOST ) in NL25 dont come to the tables to make money , they just dont.

they come to enjoy and have fun , most of them have a day job and they just want to fuck around and spew some money off , and even a larger percentage is an individual who deposited 50$~250$ to play poker for the first time and lose all his money , its the kind of people that sit with 12.24$ or 8.45$ in the table (and afterwards he'll say that it's rigged and he'll never play again)

That's at least what i think . they dont have any higher understanding of the game and will not respond to "fancy" stuff.

So in summery , i believe that In NL25 you should play ABC poker generally .
What i did when i was Playing NL25 is identifying e-v-e-r-y player's Level in poker from 1-3 .
1 being the player that thinks only at their cards , 2 being the kind that also think about what might you have , and 3 (found 1 in NL25) who THINKS what you THINK he has.(Thank you LURPED,CR and HSP)

Once you realize 85% of the people in NL25 are in level 1 you're gonna understand that you cant make an idiot fold top pair , while LVL2-3 you could

EDIT**
For some reason i didnt see the 2nd part of your post
Yea , i agree 100% with that

How can 10 % be most?

On June 22 2009 01:56 jasper5408 wrote: anyway u bring up a good point college about raising with hands that don't have much pre or post flop value. Why is this? i do this on occasion as well, raising qj, Ax (in the blinds more often actually) why do we do this? i mean when i do it i expect to pick up the pot like 80% of the time, but i never really understood why we did it with these hands, vs any other random hand or random moment. it just seems like an occasional bluff to pick up an occasional pot without resistance.

hmm hands like KJ QJ is an ok hand to 3bet if you'd be happy about stacking off on Q high or J high boards. otherwise i'd just flat and take a flop or fold depending on villain's stats. basically QJ can be 3bet for value against people who will call with a lot of hands, out of position, and play overaggressively postflop. this is especially true in higher levels where people will more often 4bet hands that dominate you and fold others, calling very rarely if ever with hands that dominate yours. it's kind of iffy to try 3betting QJ for value at 25nl cuz people will flat hands like AQ AJ against your 3bets and you wouldn't like playing for stacks with top pair at all when those hands are a part of their range.

i've seen people 3betting hands like JTs, but this is a waste of a great hand that flops tremendously well by flopping tons of draws. the J and T also gives u top pair decent kicker a fair amount of the time. if you have a hand like A7o, it's hard to go very far with your top pair. it's basically a trash hand that will take you nowhere unless you flop like two pair or better, which doesn't happen often enough to compensate for calling pre. so these hands rather find their value in being played as bluffs preflop. and as for reasons why you'd want to 3bet bluff with these hands, you do it when the guy either folds too much to 3bets or calls pre and folds a lot to your cbets. it's all dead money that's there for you to collect.

the thing is, random microstakes villains call with so much crap and never fold postflop that i think the most solid plan is to never polarize your 3betting and just 3bet purely for value with, say, JJ+/AQ+ and maybe KQ