do you fold? if so, where?

PokerStars Game #37225200208: Tournament #241010496, $10+$1 USD Holdem No Limit - Level XVIII (500/1000) - 2009/12/26 17:14:11 ET
Table 241010496 435 9-max Seat #8 is the button
Seat 1: lNormaJean (31320 in chips)
Seat 2: Jetom (30564 in chips)
Seat 3: hellraiserQ9 (34610 in chips)
Seat 5: Golf5.:R32 (22425 in chips)
Seat 6: vicsi23 (27398 in chips)
Seat 7: Hero (49724 in chips)
Seat 8: TheTyfoon (34586 in chips)
Seat 9: eduardodufas (48448 in chips)
lNormaJean: posts the ante 125
Jetom: posts the ante 125
hellraiserQ9: posts the ante 125
Golf5.:R32: posts the ante 125
vicsi23: posts the ante 125
Hero: posts the ante 125
TheTyfoon: posts the ante 125
eduardodufas: posts the ante 125
eduardodufas: posts small blind 500
lNormaJean: posts big blind 1000

Holecards
Dealt to Hero
Jetom: calls 1000
hellraiserQ9: folds
Golf5.:R32: folds
djgeter is connected
vicsi23: raises 4000 to 5000
djgeter has returned
Hero: calls 5000
TheTyfoon: folds
eduardodufas: folds
lNormaJean: folds
Jetom: folds

Flop (Pot : $13,500.00)

   
vicsi23: checks
Hero: bets 7000
vicsi23: raises 15273 to 22273 and is all-in
Hero: ?????

0 votes

overpair, 15 in 43k, looks like easy call
+ you still have 20k left.

In this position I feel like this is soooo dependant on your read and image at the table. This bet could mean alot of different things depending on what kind of player he is and what image he has of your own playing style. Personally, I'd click "Call" and close my eyes.

You're getting about 3 to 1 on your money, so theoritically if you beat him once for every 4 calls, you should be breakeven, once for every 3 and you're showing a profit. Again, it comes down to the range you assign him and his play prior to this decision.

fold...There isn't much u beat anymore...but a bluff...king queen clubs ur flipping pretty much...I think save ur money and move on...

i'd also say call, since if he only calls he is almost pot commited since he'll have only half the pot left in his stack, so his only choice here is to fold or shove. so i guess he'd shove at least with any pair or flushdraw and maybe even any overcards.

He has 25 BBs. He raises 5x and you call with TT. (I doubt this is good but whatever).

You cannot possibly call for set value, means on some flops you have to get it in. For instance on this
flop, because you have an overpair. So, if you are going to fold to this, don't call pre.

On December 26 2009 17:52 pluzich wrote: He has 25 BBs. He raises 5x and you call with TT. (I doubt this is good but whatever). You cannot possibly call for set value, means on some flops you have to get it in. For instance on this flop, because you have an overpair. So, if you are going to fold to this, don't call pre.

I completely agree

If you are going to call pre you need to call now

3:1 on your call, i'm too lazy to stove this but if you include AK/Q/Jcc in his range and overs it's probably ev+, plus people tend to lead the flop with overs so in my mind there's a good chance you're actually flipping.

rofl u can't fold

On December 26 2009 17:52 pluzich wrote: He has 25 BBs. He raises 5x and you call with TT. (I doubt this is good but whatever). You cannot possibly call for set value, means on some flops you have to get it in. For instance on this flop, because you have an overpair. So, if you are going to fold to this, don't call pre.

this

On December 26 2009 17:52 pluzich wrote: He has 25 BBs. He raises 5x and you call with TT. (I doubt this is good but whatever). You cannot possibly call for set value, means on some flops you have to get it in. For instance on this flop, because you have an overpair. So, if you are going to fold to this, don't call pre.

THIS.
But LOL, seriously, how do you call a 5x raise pre, continue to have an over pair on the flop and consider folding.
Stop being so results oriented and make up your mind whether you are going to fold pre, shove pre, or call preflop
and get it in on a flop like this. as played im guessing you snap called and he showed up with JJ-AA.

ship it in preflop or instacall flop imo

On December 26 2009 20:41 Zep wrote: as played im guessing you snap called and he showed up with JJ-AA.

i felt like i was beat....i tanked a bit and just called and he showed up with AA......it really felt like an overpair thats why i wanted some comments......

also, i tanked and thought about folding pre, but decided to just flat pre because im in position, no point in pushing all in preflop, id rather just use my position on the table

I'd fold that board as played, its obvious he's crushed, and the other times I think he's flipping, but the majority of his range is weighted towards hands that crush him.

S N A P call! This guy has some complete BS here. This is a classic "Shit, I missed that board with KT and I have no balls so I check. Well now that he bet I cant call so I guess all in is good."Call

pluzich said it perfectly.

Let's see.

$11 stars tourney at 500/1000/125 at 5:14pm EST. I'm guessing this is the daily 15k.

That being said, the are a TON of bad players in this tourney who are going to be playing their hands face up. That being said, you can definitely wait for a better spot to be getting your money in against the absolutely terrible players left in the tourney later on. If he is in fact a bad player, he won't be getting his money in the middle (with he is pretty much doing here) with air, so he has least has a FD or over pair here. You are not in great shape at all against that kind of range, and if you fold you still have about 37bb, so I think a fold here might be best. That is plenty of chips to work with later on and be able to build a big stack with if you just nit it up. Think about the tournament you are playing in these kind of spots and play accordingly... there is no need to go with marginal situations in a tourney like this if you KNOW you will get MUCH better spots with a decent stack in the future given how bad the average player is in a medium field such as this.