Where are we all headed? - Page 2

On December 20 2012 22:03 NeillyJQ wrote: jlost88 and i were talking about this in 2008-2009. this has been how poker has been heading from the start, if you didn't look forward thats your fault which is when i switched to mtts cuz they soft for long long time~ ne ways, happy you're having a realization. gl

you surely saw this coming, thats why you have $500 - $10 dinner to your name

On December 20 2012 23:06 Arirang wrote: if 10-40bb is not as complex as deeper poker, shouldn't it become tougher quicker than cash.

Dead money gets washed around a LOT longer in the tournament economy, the higher variance creates delusion regarding relative skill levels, they are completely different beasts.

Those nits probably made a lot of money from drunk tourists thou, so they played the way they believed was right. Of course they will be no match for an experienced good online grinder, but when like half - 75% of their good hands get payed off in some way i can also understand that they dont really care about the 35 cent edge preflop on blind steal or whatever / or caring about what used to be the occational other grinder at the table at all

i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better.

if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects.

as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges.

On December 21 2012 07:08 MARSHALL28 wrote: i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better. if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects. as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges.

I'm pretty sure I know where you play at, and your games are still 2004ish.

I also play there occasionnaly and it is the softest online games I've EVER seen (started in 2006). It's even softer than when we had french and italians players all over.

So your theory doesn't really apply.

Seriously on that site, NL200/NL400 is softer than NL5 on stars, wish I had the guts to take shots at the soft NL1000/NL2000 tables and claim that ' I am always improving ' and a ' great poker player ', while it's even softer than fucking live poker.

Anyway, just saying that whatever you say doesn't really apply to the actual reality of online poker.

"but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before"


made me laugh, since you get to sit with 3+ sportsbetting degens (on a 6max) that are not sure if a flush is stronger than a straight (I do too btw), that bet pot every street for the funs, etc. It's just that I get a smile on my face when I see delusional players sitting on the softest games ever and claiming to improve/be awesome. Most of the time, those regs are so awful, they deserve a smacking in the face for playing that many years of online poker and being still so awful. But still most of them print, just as much as people did in 2003-2006

Same, identical thing happens in Casinos and live poker, identical.

Anyway, back to topic... Live poker will take a hell of a long time to die off and same thing for MTTs (live and online)....

Which site is this ?

I guess the only thing I can agree on about live poker beeing dead is that the Las Vegas games are probably not that great off tourist season... I cant imagine them beeing bad under f.example WSOP.... I saw too much crazyness on 2.5/5 (where u can make decent money) when I was over

ye sites like bodog are mental nl50 is softer than nl2 on stars and the destroy ur life skills with poker is overrated a ton. Ive worked 9months in sales and you get all people skills back when you speak to 100ppl everyday and the skills are largely transferrable, the positive attitude constant learning hard work discipline fun at what you do that you learn at poker u can use everywere. Plus Its never late to get education and change direction in life. If ur winning and enjoying it no reason to quit or think bout stuff like this

On December 21 2012 07:12 careface_ wrote: Show nested quote + On December 21 2012 07:08 MARSHALL28 wrote: i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better. if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects. as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges. I'm pretty sure I know where you play at, and your games are still 2004ish. I also play there occasionnaly and it is the softest online games I've EVER seen (started in 2006). It's even softer than when we had french and italians players all over. So your theory doesn't really apply. Seriously on that site, NL200/NL400 is softer than NL5 on stars, wish I had the guts to take shots at the soft NL1000/NL2000 tables and claim that ' I am always improving ' and a ' great poker player ', while it's even softer than fucking live poker. Anyway, just saying that whatever you say doesn't really apply to the actual reality of online poker.

whats the drawback of playing on that site? there must be a drawback right?

On December 21 2012 10:00 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On December 21 2012 07:12 careface_ wrote:   On December 21 2012 07:08 MARSHALL28 wrote: i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better. if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects. as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges. I'm pretty sure I know where you play at, and your games are still 2004ish. I also play there occasionnaly and it is the softest online games I've EVER seen (started in 2006). It's even softer than when we had french and italians players all over. So your theory doesn't really apply. Seriously on that site, NL200/NL400 is softer than NL5 on stars, wish I had the guts to take shots at the soft NL1000/NL2000 tables and claim that ' I am always improving ' and a ' great poker player ', while it's even softer than fucking live poker. Anyway, just saying that whatever you say doesn't really apply to the actual reality of online poker. whats the drawback of playing on that site? there must be a drawback right?

I guess its one of those shady italian sites where u dont even know if ure gonna get the money when u cashout

On December 20 2012 23:06 Arirang wrote: Show nested quote + On December 20 2012 22:22 thewh00sel wrote: @neilly I'm not sure MTTs are softer than cash from a theoretical standpoint. There's only so much innovation/adjustments you can do with 10-40bb. Not saying either is dead or dying any time soon but edges are smaller in MTTs and rake eats a lot of profits. if 10-40bb is not as complex as deeper poker, shouldn't it become tougher quicker than cash.

Yeah that's what I was implying.

well donks stay in mtt alot longer. A guy from work quit after a 12k score to play poker. If i played him hu id get a huge boner, he was terribad its so easy to be delusional.

On December 21 2012 07:12 careface_ wrote: Show nested quote + On December 21 2012 07:08 MARSHALL28 wrote: i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better. if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects. as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges. I'm pretty sure I know where you play at, and your games are still 2004ish. I also play there occasionnaly and it is the softest online games I've EVER seen (started in 2006). It's even softer than when we had french and italians players all over. So your theory doesn't really apply. Seriously on that site, NL200/NL400 is softer than NL5 on stars, wish I had the guts to take shots at the soft NL1000/NL2000 tables and claim that ' I am always improving ' and a ' great poker player ', while it's even softer than fucking live poker. Anyway, just saying that whatever you say doesn't really apply to the actual reality of online poker.

have no idea what you're talking about. i play hu regularly against the toughest regs across all 4 sites i play on at the highest or 2nd highest limits available.

u think it has to do with guts? ... lol ... if it were so easy, everybody would do it. but okay, call me a liar. lemme know if u wanna play.

You and me will all go down in history,
With a sad Statue of Liberty,
And a Generation that didn't agree.

On December 21 2012 10:00 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On December 21 2012 07:12 careface_ wrote:   On December 21 2012 07:08 MARSHALL28 wrote: i have a hobby that pays all my bills and then some ... i only take part in it when i really feel like, and i never have to report to anyone. don't really see how things could get much better. if it gets so drastic that im making like $40/hr grinding .5/1 and i have to play 30 hours a week just to pay the bills, then obviously i need to look toward the future--if it ever gets to that point i'll probly just splerge on 10k worth of coaching and learn plo. but for now ... the games "getting tougher" is the last thing on my mind. people have been saying they've been getting tougher for years .. and ya it's definitely true that the game evolves and 6 months ago will always be slightly softer than the present, but through all that i've been improving at a much faster rate and winning much more than before, so i dunno, it doesn't factor into my decision too much cuz i dont seem to 'feel' it's effects. as long as there are people willing to play poker, a perceptive player will be able to find edges. I'm pretty sure I know where you play at, and your games are still 2004ish. I also play there occasionnaly and it is the softest online games I've EVER seen (started in 2006). It's even softer than when we had french and italians players all over. So your theory doesn't really apply. Seriously on that site, NL200/NL400 is softer than NL5 on stars, wish I had the guts to take shots at the soft NL1000/NL2000 tables and claim that ' I am always improving ' and a ' great poker player ', while it's even softer than fucking live poker. Anyway, just saying that whatever you say doesn't really apply to the actual reality of online poker. whats the drawback of playing on that site? there must be a drawback right?

no individual, sane and of average intelligence, would ever say anything like that if it were actually true. he claims the games are so soft but at the same time cant beat them??? ... lol

I play in the same live games cosmo does, I did the same evaluation and decided to move to Rosarito to play online for a short stretch. There's generally only two 5/10 games in town on a regular basis, and so you can't really game select. You have to basically set up shop and jump between the games, and some days both games aren't special. Second crappy thing is there's no 2/5, you have to jump down to 2/3, and the rake is the same, so overall a pretty brutal environment unless you are top dog. I don't consider myself anything special beyond solid player, so I figured venturing back to online might have been smarter.

As far as live poker goes, there will always be consistent 5/10NL+ action in a few select cities, beyond that it comes down to being able to properly game select, as well as being able to identify when your hourly is higher in a smaller game.

It is very much a "now or nothing" sorta thing with poker, and were the economy stronger I think it would be a fist pump decision to venture into the real world. But I guess those sorta go hand in hand now that I think about it. If the economy rebounds, the poker games get softer again. So it will always be in a cycle.

I still think the best option is to play poker and finance pet projects in areas that you enjoy. You have to put a lot of time into it, but if your job is poker you can have a hobby that in turn makes you extra money, just the same way people have poker as their hobby.

I was having a similar monologue recently with respect to not having too many friends that dont play poker, and ultimately that came down to my lack of socializing, not the profession I have chosen. People can play poker and have a good social network. I think if I had a normal job, my social life would probably be somewhat similar. So really, the friends you can get from the job shouldn't be in question, it's moreso what options offer the best income, and I believe that poker is still easily beatable provided you put in the proper investment of time and studying.

People have been saying poker is getting tougher since I started back in 2005. It's true, but there are still a ton of fish/regfish.

We've seen many regs switch their game of preference whether it be online to live, NLH to PLO or limit to mixed games. A lot of us also stuck with same game by refining our strat and constantly revising our plays to stay ahead of the game. Regs who went busto are simply the ones who couldn't adapt. Problem now is that poker is in what's called a progress trap.

On December 21 2012 10:00 Stroggoz wrote: whats the drawback of playing on that site? there must be a drawback right?

No RB, limited number of tables, now anonymous games (wasnt like that before), no promos, no bonuses, shitty software, very shady management, no HH, no hud.

I never leave more than 15 buy ins

On December 21 2012 17:59 MARSHALL28 wrote: no individual, sane and of average intelligence, would ever say anything like that if it were actually true. he claims the games are so soft but at the same time cant beat them??? ... lol

I said I crushed them, just like you, it's just that I am not meant to play NL1000/NL2000, at least I think.

I probably crush 1-2/2-4/3-6 SH at 8ptbb/100 on that site, or around that. And I am fine with this, I will not move up even if the games are just as soft 1 limit or 2 limit higher. I am very very happy with my hourly, my winrate and my 'confort zone'

The difference is that I do not brag about crushing fucking retarded-ridiculous-etc games, I admit that they are soft as fuck and a monkey could win at 1ptbb/100 (literally a monkey) and that I am not special for printing this kind of easy money. Instead of showing off without explaining that you are playing against 5 other braindead and probably blind idiots.


Anyway this was off topic a bit... back to topic I guess.