Politics thread (USA Elections 2016) - Page 162

On September 14 2019 09:57 Spitfiree wrote: Santafairy you are Trump supporter,,, but also like Sanders?

are you asking why I would like an old guy who has been ranting against the establishment for 30 years?

On September 14 2019 06:44 Santafairy wrote: not if I can help it

You're right, your gotchas are the worst. Its fitting your response was just a photo of the KJU meetup because nothing was accomplished, all the fiasco was was a photo-op.

Baal still crushes you with bad timing though.

A return to isolationism!

On September 14 2019 08:08 LemOn[5thF] wrote: I'd assume everyone on the left the way the party is now would be for the VAT+UBI Combo btw

Not really. Tax millionaires and corporations is more straightforward and addresses inequality more directly.

On September 14 2019 11:36 Santafairy wrote: Show nested quote + On September 14 2019 09:57 Spitfiree wrote: Santafairy you are Trump supporter,,, but also like Sanders? are you asking why I would like an old guy who has been ranting against the establishment for 30 years?

Well yeah... since Trump is pretty pro-establishment. He brought chaos but not chaos with intent to change, chaos due to incompetence is more like it.

On September 14 2019 02:13 Stroggoz wrote: Yang is not so great. Things like the green new deal are far more suited to rebuilding the economy than a ubi. A full employment policy would add at least $2.4trillion to the economy for example. I don't think yang has read much of the economics on these various economic policies. These comments on A.I taking people's jobs are unfounded, there are plenty of other jobs that can be made with this technological transition. Joblessness is overwhelming the result of policy, not technology. I also prefer the candidates that have had a real history in activism, unlike yang. Baal so you think Warren is 'ruining the economy' for stopping the one thing that is significantly harming the global economy. You actually think stopping fracking and offshore drilling makes someone a 'blithering idiot' or a 'machaevellion'? really? Ok...

The green new deal is absolutely retarded, especially the jobs gurantee the state creating millions of Sisyphean jobs doesn't add a single penny to the economy, quite the contrary, I can't think of many worse economic ideas, it plan also wants to eliminate nuclear.

I agree that Yang's views on A.I. are wrong and a small UBI as supplement to social programs rather than a big UBI as a replacement for them is terrible, but it could lead to eventual dissolvement of these programs if the cash seem to work best, one can only dream, also In general terms I wouldn't like an activist as a leader, I dont want ideologues or demagoges.

Yes I think that a president than on the first day through executive orders blocks all fracking and oil expansions tanking the US economy overnight is a blithering idiot or a cynic in somebody's pocket, anybody with half a brain would just invest in nuclear research and construction and as your power output grows you phase out dirty energy sources by order from most to least polluting, starting with coal, the research and production would drop the nuclear energy cost even lower and you can even help building nuclear enegy programs for big developing nations like India, China, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, México etc, because we are going to be the biggest polluters in the next decades, not the first world.

Also natural gas burns cleanly and of these fuels its the one who produces the least CO2 per Btu, so it should be the last one to go, not the first one, Warren's plan would increase CO2 production right out the bat besides creating a 1919 resession.

On September 14 2019 11:17 Liquid`Drone wrote: just look at this man, https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...st_polls/democratic_nomination_polls/ there's a singular poll where he's at 5% and in 5th place. every single other one has him at 3% at most, some 1%. He's far behind all the ones with an actual shot, consistently below buttigieg, and on average behind booker and o rourke too. He has insane appeal with a small demographic, but his ideas aren't nearly matured enough (especially with the population at large) for it to be a central point of this election. I don't have anything against him, guy seems swell, it's not my preferred solution (wants to maintain a consumption focused economy, which I think climate dictates we need to abandon), but my gripe is with the notion that he'd be a frontrunner if the media gave him a legit shot. Like if you look at https://www.npr.org/2019/09/11/759574...overall-are-lukewarm-on-democrats-tru , you can see that while it is true that Yang has very high 'unsure/never heard' numbers, his favorable to unfavorable rating just isn't that good either.. (36 favorable 17 unfavorable with democrats and democratic leaning independents, warren 75-11, buttigieg 52-11, sanders 66-27, biden 71-22).

he's been 5-6th for ages
But cable news coverage was around 13th
https://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/...like-andrew-tulsi-bernie-and-marianne

I'm just pointing out how the media is manipulating the election, I suppose it's not surprising to you. Not that he'd be a frontrunner.

As I pointed out he's about the VAT+UBI Combo it's got no chance of being implemented in one term and he wouldn't get a second one. And DNC don't give him crap and don't scrutinise VAT rising all prices in lieu of UBI because everyone else wants to run on massive deficits with their policies, Trump would likely dismantle him.

On September 15 2019 02:31 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On September 14 2019 02:13 Stroggoz wrote: Yang is not so great. Things like the green new deal are far more suited to rebuilding the economy than a ubi. A full employment policy would add at least $2.4trillion to the economy for example. I don't think yang has read much of the economics on these various economic policies. These comments on A.I taking people's jobs are unfounded, there are plenty of other jobs that can be made with this technological transition. Joblessness is overwhelming the result of policy, not technology. I also prefer the candidates that have had a real history in activism, unlike yang. Baal so you think Warren is 'ruining the economy' for stopping the one thing that is significantly harming the global economy. You actually think stopping fracking and offshore drilling makes someone a 'blithering idiot' or a 'machaevellion'? really? Ok... The green new deal is absolutely retarded, especially the jobs gurantee the state creating millions of Sisyphean jobs doesn't add a single penny to the economy, quite the contrary, I can't think of many worse economic ideas, it plan also wants to eliminate nuclear. I agree that Yang's views on A.I. are wrong and a small UBI as supplement to social programs rather than a big UBI as a replacement for them is terrible, but it could lead to eventual dissolvement of these programs if the cash seem to work best, one can only dream, also In general terms I wouldn't like an activist as a leader, I dont want ideologues or demagoges. Yes I think that a president than on the first day through executive orders blocks all fracking and oil expansions tanking the US economy overnight is a blithering idiot or a cynic in somebody's pocket, anybody with half a brain would just invest in nuclear research and construction and as your power output grows you phase out dirty energy sources by order from most to least polluting, starting with coal, the research and production would drop the nuclear energy cost even lower and you can even help building nuclear enegy programs for big developing nations like India, China, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, México etc, because we are going to be the biggest polluters in the next decades, not the first world. Also natural gas burns cleanly and of these fuels its the one who produces the least CO2 per Btu, so it should be the last one to go, not the first one, Warren's plan would increase CO2 production right out the bat besides creating a 1919 resession.

All of these candidates besides maybe Biden will trigger a rapid recession anyways with their policies...Stock market's in a bubble already, Trump himself said so in the last election

I mean that's the noble and right thing to do from the US to slow down economic growth, cut their own economic dominance in exchange for leading the world by example on sustainability.


As to nuclear, yeah...Yang mentioned more effective nuclear technology like Thorium, cutting cold turkey is just crazy. And expecting economically developing countries to skip Nuclear phase altogether is just madness

On September 14 2019 11:36 Santafairy wrote: Show nested quote + On September 14 2019 09:57 Spitfiree wrote: Santafairy you are Trump supporter,,, but also like Sanders? are you asking why I would like an old guy who has been ranting against the establishment for 30 years?

You mean ranting against capitalism? He's pushing a communist agenda and trying to sow the seeds of complete government control. How could anyone vote for him? You'd have to be either lazy with no ambition, ignorant, or evil.

On September 15 2019 16:39 LemOn[5thF] wrote: Show nested quote + On September 15 2019 02:31 Baalim wrote:   On September 14 2019 02:13 Stroggoz wrote: Yang is not so great. Things like the green new deal are far more suited to rebuilding the economy than a ubi. A full employment policy would add at least $2.4trillion to the economy for example. I don't think yang has read much of the economics on these various economic policies. These comments on A.I taking people's jobs are unfounded, there are plenty of other jobs that can be made with this technological transition. Joblessness is overwhelming the result of policy, not technology. I also prefer the candidates that have had a real history in activism, unlike yang. Baal so you think Warren is 'ruining the economy' for stopping the one thing that is significantly harming the global economy. You actually think stopping fracking and offshore drilling makes someone a 'blithering idiot' or a 'machaevellion'? really? Ok... The green new deal is absolutely retarded, especially the jobs gurantee the state creating millions of Sisyphean jobs doesn't add a single penny to the economy, quite the contrary, I can't think of many worse economic ideas, it plan also wants to eliminate nuclear. I agree that Yang's views on A.I. are wrong and a small UBI as supplement to social programs rather than a big UBI as a replacement for them is terrible, but it could lead to eventual dissolvement of these programs if the cash seem to work best, one can only dream, also In general terms I wouldn't like an activist as a leader, I dont want ideologues or demagoges. Yes I think that a president than on the first day through executive orders blocks all fracking and oil expansions tanking the US economy overnight is a blithering idiot or a cynic in somebody's pocket, anybody with half a brain would just invest in nuclear research and construction and as your power output grows you phase out dirty energy sources by order from most to least polluting, starting with coal, the research and production would drop the nuclear energy cost even lower and you can even help building nuclear enegy programs for big developing nations like India, China, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, México etc, because we are going to be the biggest polluters in the next decades, not the first world. Also natural gas burns cleanly and of these fuels its the one who produces the least CO2 per Btu, so it should be the last one to go, not the first one, Warren's plan would increase CO2 production right out the bat besides creating a 1919 resession. All of these candidates besides maybe Biden will trigger a rapid recession anyways with their policies...Stock market's in a bubble already, Trump himself said so in the last election I mean that's the noble and right thing to do from the US to slow down economic growth, cut their own economic dominance in exchange for leading the world by example on sustainability. As to nuclear, yeah...Yang mentioned more effective nuclear technology like Thorium, cutting cold turkey is just crazy. And expecting economically developing countries to skip Nuclear phase altogether is just madness

Don't forget these people also want to take away our guns and believe that there is systemic racism in America (prison system etc) against minorities. They are essentially saying we want to disarm white people and convince minorities that white people are persecuting them. It could be a very dangerous time to be in america if you have light skin.

On September 15 2019 17:38 shootair wrote: Show nested quote + On September 14 2019 11:36 Santafairy wrote:   On September 14 2019 09:57 Spitfiree wrote: Santafairy you are Trump supporter,,, but also like Sanders? are you asking why I would like an old guy who has been ranting against the establishment for 30 years? You mean ranting against capitalism? He's pushing a communist agenda and trying to sow the seeds of complete government control. How could anyone vote for him? You'd have to be either lazy with no ambition, ignorant, or evil.

People are willing to forgo freedom for equality, it's pretty natural, the struggle between the two will always be there (as it should be to keep balance)

But it was hilarious how CNN after the first debate were laughing at Bernie, saying how he failed because he looked like a hologram sent from 2016 without new sound bytes. Where that's exactly what makes him stand out.

You can disagree with his policies (I agree with selective ones, disagree with other) but you got to give him credit for his integrity as a politician - and understand why people'd be drawn by that.

On September 15 2019 17:44 shootair wrote: Don't forget these people also want to take away our guns and believe that there is systemic racism in America (prison system etc) against minorities. They are essentially saying we want to disarm white people and convince minorities that white people are persecuting them. It could be a very dangerous time to be in america if you have light skin.

What are you talking about, of course there is systematic racism in the US

also lol @ Sanders being a communist

This is how I picture people liek you

It tickles me greatly seeing Trudeau apologize for wearing facepaint 20 years ago. I always wonder what goes through a liberal's head when they get caught up in the bullshit outrage culture that their side has created. It was only < 10 years ago that we all decided wearing black facepaint was the equivalent of being a grand wizard in the KKK. SNL was using black facepaint on the regular for their celebrity impersonations and nobody gave a shit.

Trudeau being pathetic and spineless as usual, It's quite fun watching them hurt by their own weapons and given how much he loves cosplay and SJWs getting more retarded every day this is probably not going to be the last apology from him.

The ironic thing is that the right is more resilient to these attacks, an old foto of Trump in blackface would do nothing to him, but it would be torpedo Warren or Sander's career, this is along the lines of what I discussed with Loco months ago, the left pushing censorship is insanely self destructive, censorship is a right-wing tactic, they are building the gallows where themselves will hang.

On September 20 2019 04:25 Baalim wrote: Trudeau being pathetic and spineless as usual, It's quite fun watching them hurt by their own weapons and given how much he loves cosplay and SJWs getting more retarded every day this is probably not going to be the last apology from him. The ironic thing is that the right is more resilient to these attacks, an old foto of Trump in blackface would do nothing to him, but it would be torpedo Warren or Sander's career, this is along the lines of what I discussed with Loco months ago, the left pushing censorship is insanely self destructive, censorship is a right-wing tactic, they are building the gallows where themselves will hang.

What kind of reaction is he facing from the left? Between "he is a racist/ we can't vote for him/ he needs to be banned from politics" (like if a Republican was caught with this non sense) and "Blackface isn't so bad actually because he is one of us".

On September 15 2019 02:31 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On September 14 2019 02:13 Stroggoz wrote: Yang is not so great. Things like the green new deal are far more suited to rebuilding the economy than a ubi. A full employment policy would add at least $2.4trillion to the economy for example. I don't think yang has read much of the economics on these various economic policies. These comments on A.I taking people's jobs are unfounded, there are plenty of other jobs that can be made with this technological transition. Joblessness is overwhelming the result of policy, not technology. I also prefer the candidates that have had a real history in activism, unlike yang. Baal so you think Warren is 'ruining the economy' for stopping the one thing that is significantly harming the global economy. You actually think stopping fracking and offshore drilling makes someone a 'blithering idiot' or a 'machaevellion'? really? Ok... The green new deal is absolutely retarded, especially the jobs gurantee the state creating millions of Sisyphean jobs doesn't add a single penny to the economy, quite the contrary, I can't think of many worse economic ideas, it plan also wants to eliminate nuclear. I agree that Yang's views on A.I. are wrong and a small UBI as supplement to social programs rather than a big UBI as a replacement for them is terrible, but it could lead to eventual dissolvement of these programs if the cash seem to work best, one can only dream, also In general terms I wouldn't like an activist as a leader, I dont want ideologues or demagoges. Yes I think that a president than on the first day through executive orders blocks all fracking and oil expansions tanking the US economy overnight is a blithering idiot or a cynic in somebody's pocket, anybody with half a brain would just invest in nuclear research and construction and as your power output grows you phase out dirty energy sources by order from most to least polluting, starting with coal, the research and production would drop the nuclear energy cost even lower and you can even help building nuclear enegy programs for big developing nations like India, China, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, México etc, because we are going to be the biggest polluters in the next decades, not the first world. Also natural gas burns cleanly and of these fuels its the one who produces the least CO2 per Btu, so it should be the last one to go, not the first one, Warren's plan would increase CO2 production right out the bat besides creating a 1919 resession.

https://truthout.org/articles/noam-ch...-want-a-future-green-new-deal-is-key/ this interview basically points out very quickly why the green new deal is a very viable win/win policy on economics and climate change.

it doesnt point out anything, actually its quite a superficial take on it, it doesn't go in depth in neither the economics nor the energy part of it and actually Chomsky is factually wrong more than once there to the point where it reeks of dishonesty:



Anybody who knows anything about the energetic sectors knows very well this isn't remotely true, only eco-conspiracy theorists that believe "big oil/coal" push clean energies out, no they don't... they are simply cheaper, the second any other energy source is cheaper no lobbying on this planet will stop an instant transition.

Also, haven't you noticed a pattern yet? ... no mention of nuclear energy!. We have an economically viable, clean and vast form of energy (unlike the others) and it isn't being discussed, its completely ignored because it scares activist hippies and who in their nuclear boycott will do more harm than 100 oil companies.

Anybody who thinks climate change is an existencial threat, yet quickly discards nuclear energy is just an ideologue, his opinions on the subject are nothing but noise, sadly Chomsky has joined those ranks.



TLDR version: if you want to reduce CO2 emissions lets talk nuclear and progressive phasing out of fossil, if you want to implement socialized healthcare, goverment enforced sysyphean full employment and the pursuit of masificaton of inefficient and impractical and expensive energy then don't get surprised if you aren't taken seriously.

On September 20 2019 21:09 GoTuNk wrote: Show nested quote + On September 20 2019 04:25 Baalim wrote: Trudeau being pathetic and spineless as usual, It's quite fun watching them hurt by their own weapons and given how much he loves cosplay and SJWs getting more retarded every day this is probably not going to be the last apology from him. The ironic thing is that the right is more resilient to these attacks, an old foto of Trump in blackface would do nothing to him, but it would be torpedo Warren or Sander's career, this is along the lines of what I discussed with Loco months ago, the left pushing censorship is insanely self destructive, censorship is a right-wing tactic, they are building the gallows where themselves will hang. What kind of reaction is he facing from the left? Between "he is a racist/ we can't vote for him/ he needs to be banned from politics" (like if a Republican was caught with this non sense) and "Blackface isn't so bad actually because he is one of us".

He obviousy was spared by the media, they even called it "darkened face" to avoid saying black-face, but he had to grovel and give that pathetic apology, a sitting president won't go down just for black-face regardless of party but I think liberals can be harmed more with this because the outrage mob is their voting base.

Well you complain about the interview having superficial answers but lets be honest your not going to bother to learn economics and read pollins studies/books on the topic, which go far more in depth. All their answers are backed up with pretty good evidence actually

sisyphean employment? Having jobs that actually save the economy and environment is a lot more meaningful than ones that destroy the environment and print money for a small group of people. There's nothing government enforced about this. millions of people want jobs, and the government can carry out plans to fill those needs. Can argue about how the green new deal should be implemented but no one would make it so the government is forcing people to get jobs in it through legal means.

On September 21 2019 03:02 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On September 20 2019 21:09 GoTuNk wrote:   On September 20 2019 04:25 Baalim wrote: Trudeau being pathetic and spineless as usual, It's quite fun watching them hurt by their own weapons and given how much he loves cosplay and SJWs getting more retarded every day this is probably not going to be the last apology from him. The ironic thing is that the right is more resilient to these attacks, an old foto of Trump in blackface would do nothing to him, but it would be torpedo Warren or Sander's career, this is along the lines of what I discussed with Loco months ago, the left pushing censorship is insanely self destructive, censorship is a right-wing tactic, they are building the gallows where themselves will hang. What kind of reaction is he facing from the left? Between "he is a racist/ we can't vote for him/ he needs to be banned from politics" (like if a Republican was caught with this non sense) and "Blackface isn't so bad actually because he is one of us". He obviousy was spared by the media, they even called it "darkened face" to avoid saying black-face, but he had to grovel and give that pathetic apology, a sitting president won't go down just for black-face regardless of party but I think liberals can be harmed more with this because the outrage mob is their voting base.

if it happened a long time ago and you can plausibly point to personal ignorance (obviously viable if it was a long time ago) and you apologize then it's fine.. if it wasn't a long time ago, or you can't plausibly point to personal ignorance, or you refuse to apologize, then it's not okay. at worst it's a disingenuous apology, hardly worth outrage.. :D

On September 21 2019 14:24 Liquid`Drone wrote: Show nested quote + On September 21 2019 03:02 Baalim wrote:   On September 20 2019 21:09 GoTuNk wrote:   On September 20 2019 04:25 Baalim wrote: Trudeau being pathetic and spineless as usual, It's quite fun watching them hurt by their own weapons and given how much he loves cosplay and SJWs getting more retarded every day this is probably not going to be the last apology from him. The ironic thing is that the right is more resilient to these attacks, an old foto of Trump in blackface would do nothing to him, but it would be torpedo Warren or Sander's career, this is along the lines of what I discussed with Loco months ago, the left pushing censorship is insanely self destructive, censorship is a right-wing tactic, they are building the gallows where themselves will hang. What kind of reaction is he facing from the left? Between "he is a racist/ we can't vote for him/ he needs to be banned from politics" (like if a Republican was caught with this non sense) and "Blackface isn't so bad actually because he is one of us". He obviousy was spared by the media, they even called it "darkened face" to avoid saying black-face, but he had to grovel and give that pathetic apology, a sitting president won't go down just for black-face regardless of party but I think liberals can be harmed more with this because the outrage mob is their voting base. if it happened a long time ago and you can plausibly point to personal ignorance (obviously viable if it was a long time ago) and you apologize then it's fine.. if it wasn't a long time ago, or you can't plausibly point to personal ignorance, or you refuse to apologize, then it's not okay. at worst it's a disingenuous apology, hardly worth outrage.. :D

I don't think there is anything wrong with darkening your face for a costume, it's just the irony of catching woke king Trudeau with this stuff.
That said, can you imagine how the media would react if there was a picture of Trump with his face painted black from 20 years ago? They would run with it 24/7 until election day.