Politics thread (USA Elections 2016) - Page 221

On June 03 2020 04:38 RiKD wrote: Show nested quote + On June 03 2020 03:07 Baalim wrote:   On June 03 2020 02:42 RiKD wrote: You may or may not be a neo-nazi but you certainly are something of an accomplice at the least. - Said the white american born in wealth to the Mexican that doesn't like SJW virtue signaling bullshit and believe in free markets and personal responsibility. You two are exactly as clueless as the beer-pong idiots and dont realize it, your heads would be the first to roll in the revolution and if you are lucky enough to keep your head guess what would be state-assigned job? making pizzas motherfucker. I'm trying to follow your arguments but you just deflect and go off on another tangent. I was born into a middle class family. Now, I am just a step above destitute. You on the other hand it sounds like came from a middle to upper class family and now are a presumably successful poker player and factory owner. You are also a light-skinned Mexican. So, you don't like SJWs, believe in free markets, and personal responsibility and what else are you leaving out? Why are all your sources far right wing sources? Our heads would be the first to roll in "the" revolution? I couldn't figure out what you were trying to say but I got it. Of course it goes back to "communism" and the "100 million" dead and blazeh blazeh blah. We've already been through that plenty of times. But if people organized over injustice continually and continually the world might end up looking better after a while. I would happily clean toilets for 4 hours a week or make pizzas for 20 hours a week under non Amazon conditions if it meant that we did it. That we had gotten to an anarcho-communist situation. But you want to talk about gulags and the state. In my dreams there is no state. How do we get there? No Justice, No Peace. I may be a hypocrite because I would happily have student debt forgiveness, free education, medicare for all, and a $2k check coming in every month. I am desperate. That doesn't mean I love the state. And of course I don't love how entwined large corporations and the state are. It's a disaster. Current destructive capitalism is a disaster. Green capitalism is a disaster. Any form of capitalism is a disaster. The environment is on the verge of collapse and people are getting very sick. Something has to give. What is it going to be?

Lmao ur not from a middle class family. Your dad makes like 200k+ a year how is that middle class ru retarded pls stop lying to make yourself feel better/win arguments by cheating.

Yes/no your parents are worth 7 figs?
Yes/no your aunt is worth millions?

Ur not fucking middle class what kind of crack ru smoking.

Pls ban rikd

On June 03 2020 09:45 hiems wrote: Show nested quote + On June 03 2020 04:38 RiKD wrote:   On June 03 2020 03:07 Baalim wrote:   On June 03 2020 02:42 RiKD wrote: You may or may not be a neo-nazi but you certainly are something of an accomplice at the least. - Said the white american born in wealth to the Mexican that doesn't like SJW virtue signaling bullshit and believe in free markets and personal responsibility. You two are exactly as clueless as the beer-pong idiots and dont realize it, your heads would be the first to roll in the revolution and if you are lucky enough to keep your head guess what would be state-assigned job? making pizzas motherfucker. I'm trying to follow your arguments but you just deflect and go off on another tangent. I was born into a middle class family. Now, I am just a step above destitute. You on the other hand it sounds like came from a middle to upper class family and now are a presumably successful poker player and factory owner. You are also a light-skinned Mexican. So, you don't like SJWs, believe in free markets, and personal responsibility and what else are you leaving out? Why are all your sources far right wing sources? Our heads would be the first to roll in "the" revolution? I couldn't figure out what you were trying to say but I got it. Of course it goes back to "communism" and the "100 million" dead and blazeh blazeh blah. We've already been through that plenty of times. But if people organized over injustice continually and continually the world might end up looking better after a while. I would happily clean toilets for 4 hours a week or make pizzas for 20 hours a week under non Amazon conditions if it meant that we did it. That we had gotten to an anarcho-communist situation. But you want to talk about gulags and the state. In my dreams there is no state. How do we get there? No Justice, No Peace. I may be a hypocrite because I would happily have student debt forgiveness, free education, medicare for all, and a $2k check coming in every month. I am desperate. That doesn't mean I love the state. And of course I don't love how entwined large corporations and the state are. It's a disaster. Current destructive capitalism is a disaster. Green capitalism is a disaster. Any form of capitalism is a disaster. The environment is on the verge of collapse and people are getting very sick. Something has to give. What is it going to be? Lmao ur not from a middle class family. Your dad makes like 200k+ a year how is that middle class ru retarded pls stop lying to make yourself feel better/win arguments by cheating. Yes/no your parents are worth 7 figs? Yes/no your aunt is worth millions? Ur not fucking middle class what kind of crack ru smoking. Pls ban rikd

I was born into a middle class family. My dad's dad was a coal miner. My mom's dad was a salesmen but got fired due to his bipolar/alcoholism. My mom's mom had to go to work as a bank teller to support the family. My dad didn't make most of his money until I was out of college. We may have been upper class for my high school years but to say I was "born into wealth" is inaccurate.

I don't know what my parents are worth but it's not like there is a trust fund. They have openly told me they plan on living their life while they can and running their retirement savings into the ground.

What does my Aunt have to do with anything? My Uncle married into that. You think I'm going to see any of that money ever? I never even met her mom who was the one who dished out the millions to immediate family only. And my Aunt maybe got $2million from that? It's still millions but certainly not $10milly. She continued to work up until this last year.

And it's more accurate to say I am in the proletariat at the moment. My parents provide me with a roof over my head and food but that is it. I'm not going on cruises around the world. No, I'm sitting at home wasting my time arguing with people like you and hanging out with the cats.

Can you imagine you can be so delusional that you compare yourself to Abraham Lincoln even though you're confirmed one of the worst pieces of shits to set step in the White House ever ( and I don't mean in the president chair, I mean like literally step in the building )

On June 03 2020 07:06 Loco wrote: I don't know why you try to play that card with RiKD when you know full well that you are materially better off than him. You have more autonomy than him and more money (he's in debt due to medical bills while you have a small fortune in bitcoins). You can't conflate him and his parents, it doesn't work like that, he's not a teenager. Maybe you have this false perception that American families are tight-knit and share everything together, maybe closer to the average Mexican family? That's not the case at all and you should be aware of this at this point in time.

I'm not saying he is richer than me I'm saying he had bigger advantages than I had, but I'm not claiming im some rags to riches story at all and I'm fully aware that a big chunk of our sucess and failures are tied to pure randomness, what Im saying is I shoudn't support someone on my dime because he doesn't feel like spinning some pizzas.

No, the opposite I think American (and most 1st world) families are shockingly fractured, its baffling to me some of the with the ease you guys cut each other off, how teens are kicked out and family members left to rot on the streets, Mexico despise its poverty doesnt face the homeless issue you guys do because you will almost always have a bed in your family or with friends, in 3rd world countries the social safety net is the family, not the state, and as you might know I'm not a family man myself, but you guys take it to a whole new level.

We also know how you justify being better off: because you worked hard, you are smarter and you were responsible. Why not just repeat that same right-wing clap trap instead of trying to gaslight the guy with the whole "Americans are always better off than Mexicans" shit? I don't understand what makes you switch gears between victim-blaming and country-shaming like that, it is truly bizarre. And how the hell do you think this kind of gaslighting is going to work when all the evidence is in the open?

So you call "country-shaming" pointing out the massive privilege you two had over me by simply being born into a 1st world country? Interesting hypocricy since privilege is the pathetic song you SJWs love to sing all day long.

It sounds like you're basically saying that he should be dying in the streets now -- that having a roof over his head and food coming from the people who brought him into this world is not something he deserves if he is not currently employed. Is that correct?

No, quite the opposite, I think he deserves to be protected by the people who brough him into the world, his parents, not from stranger taxpayers.

Ah yes, the "it's just cringe" line. I remember CringeAnarchy had the same philosophy. What happened to them? They became infested with crypto-fascists and overt Neo-Nazis who have no doubt influenced tens of thousands of people to become (more) hateful and prejudiced against minorities until they were banned:

Who gives a shit what reddit does?, Rik asked where I got the videos I replied, unsurprisingly you think laughing at how pathetic SJWs are, is nazi stuff.

That's like thinking that the way a cult is grown is by having a cult leader approach you telling you that they are recruiting for a cult, that they have a Messiah complex, that all of your holes will be violated, that you will be beaten when they feel like it, and that you will be brainwashed into committing mass suicide with your fellow cult members in order to go to Heaven at some point of their choosing. You are one gullible motherfucker. Yeah, no shit, fascist propaganda has to appeal to people who are not already fascists, so it disguises itself into "cringe" and "edgy" shit. Fucking DUH. Come to think of it, you have experience being brainwashed by a cult leader (Stefan Molyneux) already, and still haven't come to that realization yet, so it's no wonder you are confused about this.

I agreed with Stefan with open markets and an overbearing state, I disagree with many of his other opinions, why is this hard to comprehend?

I remember you like a few things Charles Manson said, does that mean you were brainwashed into a racist murderous cult? no, it just means he made a couple of good points.

You know, a reasonable person understands that where there is smoke, there is usually fire. Similarly, if the stuff you promote usually ends up coming from fascists, it should be of concern to you if you are actually serious about just being interested in "cringe" anti-SJW shit. When you start pushing a narrative that helps fascists like "Anti-fascists are responsible for the violence and looting" and "moving the status quo left is a really bad idea for white people", it really doesn't help your case in trying to distance yourself from them.

Yes anti-left stuff often comes from the hard-right, and most anti-right stuff comes from the hard left, so?

If somebody shares a meme making a good point against racists it sholudn't be shared because it was likely written by a commie?

Antifascist are responsible for a lot of the violence, the looting is mostly opportunists, and moving the status quo left is a bad idea for everyone not whites, these are MY talking points, I dont push anybody elses ideas but my own... but I know the concept of an individual is hard for you to accept.

They have openly told me they plan on living their life while they can and running their retirement savings into the ground.

I'm not even saying this to insult you, but if I had a ideologically unemployed son, I too would leave him with nothing.

On June 03 2020 03:07 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On June 03 2020 02:42 RiKD wrote: You may or may not be a neo-nazi but you certainly are something of an accomplice at the least. - Said the white american born in wealth to the Mexican that doesn't like SJW virtue signaling bullshit and believe in free markets and personal responsibility. You two are exactly as clueless as the beer-pong idiots and dont realize it, your heads would be the first to roll in the revolution and if you are lucky enough to keep your head guess what would be state-assigned job? making pizzas motherfucker.

Tbh, you really do have a history of parroting debunked right wing propaganda, at least when talking about scandinavia. I don't think you're a nazi at all, but I think you should genuinely make an effort to be more skeptical towards some of the sources you get your information from. Maybe it's all just google and twitter algorithms figuring out that you're a staunch capitalist and feeding you shit in accordance with that, but either way there have been multiple occasions (Iunno like 5?) where you had clearly been fed faulty info from a bad actor. I'm not really blaming you for it or whatever, I'm sure it happens to me as well.

On June 03 2020 20:42 Liquid`Drone wrote: Tbh, you really do have a history of parroting debunked right wing propaganda, at least when talking about scandinavia. I don't think you're a nazi at all, but I think you should genuinely make an effort to be more skeptical towards some of the sources you get your information from. Maybe it's all just google and twitter algorithms figuring out that you're a staunch capitalist and feeding you shit in accordance with that, but either way there have been multiple occasions (Iunno like 5?) where you had clearly been fed faulty info from a bad actor. I'm not really blaming you for it or whatever, I'm sure it happens to me as well.

the bahtroom thing? that was something I've heard 20 years ago from some random relative traveling to norway.

About Scandinavia I've talked about the "scandinavian paradox" that shows an statistical reverse coorelation between gender equality and traditional rolers, meaning scandinavia has less females in traditional-male roles than 3rd world countries, argument which Loco has dodged and never acknowledged because it goes against his blank slate view of gender which he denies having.

I've also mentioned that scandinavia's success was built mainly upon having the most free markets in early the XX century yet the current economy is stagnant and Sweden's biggest companies are old af and there is little entrepenuirship, which is fine to have a stagnant economy IF there isnt population increase and the quality of life is good fwiw.

Could you point out to what I've been parroting that has been debunked?

and about twitter cringy stuff I swear I've looked for so long for funny account making fun of right wingers and I just can't, I've followed Bread Panes, stonetoss parodies, Shaun, Vaush etc and they are total trash, it is not a lie when they say the left can't meme.

So I'm quite open to suggestions to balance my "slipper slope into extreme ideology cringe accounts".

On June 03 2020 22:51 Baalim wrote: and about twitter cringy stuff I swear I've looked for so long for funny account making fun of right wingers and I just can't, I've followed Bread Panes, stonetoss parodies, Shaun, Vaush etc and they are total trash, it is not a lie when they say the left can't meme. So I'm quite open to suggestions to balance my "slipper slope into extreme ideology cringe accounts".

Holy shit, this post belongs on SelfAwareWolves.

Allow me to highlight why you can only find edgy/cringe/far-right radicalization content appealing, while content making fun of right-wingers is never funny to you. You ready?

.

.

.

Because you ARE A RIGHT-WINGER. And you have already been radicalized to some serious degree, and you don't like people who make fun of you. Your values are aligned with far-right ideologies in that you are blind to structural violence and both strongly believe in certain "natural hierarchies" and victim-blaming; it's just a matter of degrees. You are NOT a fucking centrist who magically floats over the political spectrum, able to take everything in "neutrally" and "in balance" -- that's why it doesn't actually fucking happen when you try. It has nothing to do with "the left" not being funny.

But even aside of making fun of the right, there's even plenty of critiques of Identity politics / co-opted intersectionality on the Left itself: you have the Marxist class reductionists, Situationists, nihilists, insurrectionists, etc, with some places dedicated towards memeing against idpol like Stupidpol.

If you have to go to people like Stonetoss who are actual Neo-Nazis who deny the holocaust in order to get your fun you are just too far gone already. Case in point, our new troll CurbStomp who advocates for tossing political dissidents in Guantanamo also just posted a Stonetoss comic (just like you did in the past). You are a lot closer ideologically to this far-right troll than anyone else on this forum.

Let me highlight the original point in memes for you.

This is you:




This is the lie you tell yourself:

WRONG

Unlike SJWs most normal people can laugh at themselves, (perhaps some boomer Karens share that trait with SJW but I suppose indignation and self righteousness is strong in those groups), In fact I like jokes making fun of atheistm, nihilism libertarianism ancaps... in fact the BRRRRRRRRR meme was originally an ancap bitching to a boomer printing money, I found it hillarious.

I guess one can't expect people who want rape jokes banned to understand humor, anyway I'm still waiting for funny leftist twitter accounts, I'm not going to fucking reddit.

FYI I don't think im a centrist or above the political compass, I'm deeeeep into the purple quadrant, you think you are in the green but are more into the red.



In regards of the meme and this riot situation if you are curious about my stance, I thik obv the cop should go to prison and the US police is brutal, corrupt and far too powerful and needs to scale down and reform, in regards of the looting what I'd like to see is more people taking a gun ready to blow the face clean of anyone trying to destroy their business, decentralized response to protect local communities... go purple square!.

LOL I saw this shit today... guess there are mexican nazis, I bet he started watching cringy lefty stuff.

The red quadrant is about perpetuating institutional violence. Red Fascists are institutionalists (just like your quadrant and the Nazis). The only (loosely identifiable) group of people who are not in favor of institutionalized violence, i.e. hierarchical dominance, and who can inherently oppose representationalist politics are in the green one (though this is not always the case; some libertarian socialists are in favor of representation, e.g. through trade unions if you're a syndicalist). It's not possible for me to even get close to the red quadrant since I'm against representationalist politics as a whole and in favor of a system of networks based on self-organized communities where everyone represents himself.

Punching a Nazi in the face because he's harassing black people or whatever doesn't throw you in the red quadrant because there is no centralized force/institution behind the violence. The violence doesn't make an excuse for itself, it doesn't hide behind slogans, propaganda and layers of bureaucracy, unlike the violence of producing more than enough food for everyone on Earth and yet having over a billion people be malnourished while 50% of the food goes to waste and the food dumpsters are padlocked.

All politics involve violence inherently, life is tension and warfare, so the meaningful distinctions are always going to be about how insidious and prevalent different forms of violence are going to be in different systems, not whether or not you as an individual can get away with not having to commit any form of direct violence throughout your life. The violence that you commit as someone who supports/contributes towards neoliberal capitalism is extremely mediated and so you are largely blind to it, but it is far, far worse than the direct violence that a genuine anti-fascist engages in by opposing fascism, and there is not one good reason for it.

White House forced to retract their Antifa conspiracy theory post: https://theintercept.com/2020/06/04/w...ideos-prove-antifa-plotting-violence/

You are right the Y axis isn't violence and you can commit violence and be libertarian, hell I just advocated for people to arm themselves at defends their stores with lethal force if neccesary, I'd call the Y axis simply authoritarianism which to be fair is quite close to institutional violence.

I say you are a closet red becauase you support censorshp for the wrong ideas, and violence towards the wrong thinkers and only because a grouop doesn't have a clear structure you think its not authoritarianism, but violence by the mob is just as authoritarian, for example in pats of the middle east unorganized mobs formed by the family kill "dishonored" women and gays, that is the same kind of authoritarianism you fail to see in your positions, obviously in a much greater scale.

You did not advocate for punching a Nazi directly harassing somebody, in which case I'd be happy to throw the punch too, you advocated violence at any time.


For example, regarding pronouns I'm cool with calling people what they like (unless they are fucking with me) and thats what I do, but when there is a threat of violence then I'll fight that but you wouldn't, you will allow institutional violence if it suits your left wing ideals and perhaps you might even intellectually opose it, but you won't fight it because as I've said, the X axis is more important to you than the Y one, but I understand the appeal thats why you assume libertarians will become fascists if push comes to shove because they rather live under fascism than left wing libertarianism and I think you would do the same, you would support the communis if you had to chose between them or right wing libertarians... and I wouldnt, the Y axis is more important to me than the X one, I value freedom more than I do prosperity and order.

On June 03 2020 20:01 Baalim wrote: I'm not saying he is richer than me I'm saying he had bigger advantages than I had, but I'm not claiming im some rags to riches story at all and I'm fully aware that a big chunk of our sucess and failures are tied to pure randomness, what Im saying is I shoudn't support someone on my dime because he doesn't feel like spinning some pizzas.

He wasn't demanding money from you at any point, he was obviously talking about how relieving a decent UBI would be for him, which in theory would come out of mostly richer people's wealth (only to go back to them later anyway).

You go on to say that it's a good thing that people take care of each other when the going gets tough in Mexico and you deplore the "individualistic culture" of the US where people are constantly threatened with homelessness and medical bankruptcy. Yet in effect, you're saying that in those circumstances where various forces have conspired to create such a heartless culture, you'd rather have people continually struggle to meet their basic needs or be starving on the streets through austerity measures than decent social programs.

Portraying him as "just lazy" and using trivializing language like "didn't feel like making pizzas" is just wrong. No one is lazy for quitting a dead-end job they hate and which had been contributing more and more towards psychological breakdown and to accuse someone of laziness based on this is borderline malicious. It's almost like if you said to a war veteran suffering from PTSD that he's lazy for not wanting to do a job that sends him into emotional flashbacks several times a day.

No, the opposite I think American (and most 1st world) families are shockingly fractured, its baffling to me some of the with the ease you guys cut each other off, how teens are kicked out and family members left to rot on the streets, Mexico despise its poverty doesnt face the homeless issue you guys do because you will almost always have a bed in your family or with friends, in 3rd world countries the social safety net is the family, not the state, and as you might know I'm not a family man myself, but you guys take it to a whole new level.

It's not "despite", it's "because". It's incredibly well documented that mutual aid or "primitive communism" is what human beings naturally default to in times of need. In American ghettos you see the same things that you are used to seeing in Mexico. The media doesn't make money off of it so it doesn't show it, but there are a ton of mutual aid efforts going on right now with covid-19 and the BLM movement.

It's not "baffling". Capitalism now relies on increased hyper-competitivity and the way society is structured in pursuit of the "American Dream" inhibits the cooperative natures of individuals which makes them neurotic, irresponsible, abusive, etc, so of course the family unit suffers.

So you call "country-shaming" pointing out the massive privilege you two had over me by simply being born into a 1st world country? Interesting hypocricy since privilege is the pathetic song you SJWs love to sing all day long.

The hypocrisy is entirely on your end here. You promote personal responsibility and individual effort above all when it suits you, yet you have no problem lumping individuals and subsuming their individual particularities into the whole of a country when it also suits you.

It's meaningless to talk about where someone was born. A baby doesn't have opportunities. Opportunities come later on, usually after you have received formal education. Before such a thing can happen (or after), tragedies that alter the life of someone profoundly can happen anywhere in the world. In my case I was struck with an anxiety disorder that forced me to leave school before there were any possibilities open to me market-wise, but it's besides the point and I shouldn't have to talk about my life for you to know that your argument is plainly wrong.

No, quite the opposite, I think he deserves to be protected by the people who brough him into the world, his parents, not from stranger taxpayers.

Right, so you're in favor of people dying on the streets when those family members decide they can't or won't support them, and you're in favor of people being abused/dependent on their family and have no autonomy whatsoever just because they are disabled and superfluous to capital. You have to just bite the bullet here my dude.

Who gives a shit what reddit does?, Rik asked where I got the videos I replied, unsurprisingly you think laughing at how pathetic SJWs are, is nazi stuff.

It's a market that Nazis exploit, as I've shown several times, but it doesn't have to turn you into an actual Nazi in order for it to keep you an ignorant shithead. Both are bad.

I agreed with Stefan with open markets and an overbearing state, I disagree with many of his other opinions, why is this hard to comprehend?

His socio-economic views are inherently racist, sexist and ableist. "Overbearing state" and "open markets" are just euphemistic, trojan horse words to justify these types of oppression when you get them from someone like Stefan. That's where the brainwashing comes from: he strips you of your ability to know what the alternatives are, and it leads you to share his same disgusting views, like those on the welfare state and immigration which you still parrot to this day and are incredibly contradictory.

This wouldn't be the case if you were a free market anarchist/market socialist/mutualist. This is where you'd be landing if you were actually interested in true open markets and a better world for as many people as possible. Just because Stefan has some other extraneous views that are also racist, sexist and ableist that you might not share doesn't mean you are all that different. You also spread some of the same far-right propaganda whenever some new culture war debate opens up, especially when it comes to the anti-antifa stuff which you have the strongest ideological blinder for.

I remember you like a few things Charles Manson said, does that mean you were brainwashed into a racist murderous cult? no, it just means he made a couple of good points.

I honestly don't remember, maybe some nihilistic stuff about "being nobody" from 13 years ago or something. The difference would be that I never believed in a "Charles Manson Program"; I haven't spent a single minute in the last 10+ years looking at his stuff or spreading any idea of his, so it was obviously peripheral stuff; whereas your agreements with Stefan are at the center of your world -- they are foundational, and you often spread them still, e.g., "Nazis were left-wing, 'socialism is in their name!' and antifa are authoritarian communists which is a lot more dangerous than fascism"

Yes anti-left stuff often comes from the hard-right, and most anti-right stuff comes from the hard left, so?

One side is anti- certain humans. Those humans have one fundamental flaw according to them: that they were born inferior, beastly. This group's main purpose is to dehumanize other humans.

The other side is only anti- those humans who are anti- certain humans, and only temporarily so, since ideology is flexible.

Yes, I am aware that some people on the left would use power if they were to acquire it in order to discriminate against others on different lines, but to simplify things, you are engaging in a false equivalence, because the things that they are promoting in that moment are fundamentally different (don't be racist, don't be sexist, demand better work circumstances, etc). I don't trust Marxists/Leninists/Maoists in any way but the propaganda they spread is not harmful in the moment, it would be only harmful if they had a chance of being in power, which they won't be, because they believe in an outdated ideology that is widely distrusted, and class-centered struggle is absolutely impossible today. Fascism on the other hand is indeed capitalism in decay and is already in power in many places and the US itself is rampant with it, so pushing for fascist propaganda is dangerous right here and now.

If somebody shares a meme making a good point against racists it sholudn't be shared because it was likely written by a commie?

No; the issue is that you don't share those, you only share the ones that promote the far-right's racism/conspiracy theories.

Antifascist are responsible for a lot of the violence, the looting is mostly opportunists, and moving the status quo left is a bad idea for everyone not whites, these are MY talking points, I dont push anybody elses ideas but my own... but I know the concept of an individual is hard for you to accept.

Individuals are formed (structured) by other individuals. That's what a nervous system is: the collection of internalized responses to interactions with a world populated with others. As a result "your" ideas are other people's ideas. Some degree of originality is possible if you are creative (an artist, a philosopher, a researcher), but that requires you to build on previous individuals' experiences too. The only clear demarcation between individuals that exists is on a physical level, where the boundaries are obvious, but there exists no such demarcation internally at the noological level.

It's already been proven that antifascists are not responsible for a lot of the violence from the BLM protests. A lot of black activists actively deliver white people to the cops if they are trying to incite violence. They have been overwhelmingly non-violent in most states/protests and it's the cops who began the violence. There are probably hundreds of videos of police violence out there currently that are extremely brutal and don't in any way compare to some people throwing bricks and breaking windows.

As for the looting, the word "opportunists" is a value-laden word that doesn't come from your unique mind: it is spread all around right-wing and liberal spaces, and serves only the vicious purpose of reproducing systems of profound inequality, and I fully disagree with it. The only thing that I am willing to credit as "opportunism" is if someone who is materially well off and not marginalized goes on to participate in the looting. Which is still far less morally problematic than the kind of looting that is perpetuated by the capitalist ruling order and which you have never complained about.

As for "moving the status quo left is a bad idea for everyone not whites", that's just plain dumb. You said you were in favor of police reforms, which is all that BLM is about; they are not a revolutionary force. They'd be moving the status quo left on a racial basis if they are successful which would make their lives a little better and that's all, so you're holding two contradictory positions at this moment.

I just want to add this bit about Riots/Looting. As an Asian/Korean person, this is an important issue for me:

Most of us were too young to remember the LA Riots from the Rodney King incident. I became interested in it after hearing David Choe say a bunch of times "to be honest, after the LA Riots, I didn't really like black people very much for awhile" ... as his parents store was ruined as a result of the riots. It was an interesting take from an interesting guy so I read up on it a bit. Pretty much blacks/other rioters destroyed shit-ton of Korean businesses that had nothing to do with Police brutality. Anyway here are some quotes.

Many Korean Americans in Los Angeles refer to the event as Sa-I-Gu, meaning "four-two-nine" in the Korean language (4.29), in reference to April 29, 1992, which was the day the riots started. Over 2,300 mom-and-pop shops run by Korean business owners were damaged through ransacking and looting during the riots, sustaining close to $400 million in damages.[101]

During the riots, Korean Americans received very little aid or protection from police authorities, due to their low social status and language barriers.[102] Many Koreans rushed to Koreatown after Korean-language radio stations called for volunteers to guard against rioters. Many were armed, with a variety of improvised weapons, handguns, shotguns, and semi-automatic rifles.[103]

David Joo, a manager of the gun store, said, "I want to make it clear that we didn't open fire first. At that time, four police cars were there. Somebody started to shoot at us. The LAPD ran away in half a second. I never saw such a fast escape. I was pretty disappointed." Carl Rhyu, also a participant in the Koreans' armed response, said, "If it was your own business and your own property, would you be willing to trust it to someone else? We are glad the National Guard is here. They're good backup. But when our shops were burning we called the police every five minutes; no response."104] At a shopping center several miles north of Koreatown, Jay Rhee, who said he and others fired five hundred shots into the ground and air, said, "We have lost our faith in the police. Where were you when we needed you?" Koreatown was isolated from South Central Los Angeles, yet despite this, it was the most severely damaged in the riots.[102]

Korean Americans not only faced physical damage to their stores and community surroundings, but they also suffered emotional, psychological, and economic despair. About 2,300 Korean-owned stores in southern California were looted or burned, making up 45 percent of all damages caused by the riot. According to the Asian and Pacific American Counseling and Prevention Center, 730 Koreans were treated for post-traumatic stress disorder, which included symptoms such as insomnia, a sense of helplessness, and muscle pain. In reaction, many Korean Americans worked to create political and social empowerment.[102]

"Korean-Americans and their stores throughout LA's Korea town were hit the hardest by the riots, with an estimated $400 million done in damages. Despite claims that Koreatown had not been intentionally targeted during the riots, by Sunday, over 1,600 Korean-American owned stores had been completely destroyed.

Rioters targeted Korean-American shops in their areas, as there had been considerable tension between the two communities. Such sources as Newsweek and Time suggested that blacks thought Korean-American merchants were "taking money out of their community", that they were racist as they refused to hire blacks, and often treated them without respect. There were cultural and language differences, as some shopowners were immigrants.

Other scholars compare these riots to those in Detroit in the 1920s, when whites rioted against blacks.[citation needed]But instead of African-Americans as victims, the race riots "represent backlash violence in response to recent Latino and Asian immigration into African-American neighborhoods."5]

Social commentator Mike Davis pointed to the growing economic disparity in Los Angeles, caused by corporate restructuring and government deregulation, with inner city residents bearing the brunt of such changes. Such conditions engendered a widespread feeling of frustration and powerlessness in the urban populace. They reacted to the King verdicts with a violent expression of collective public protest.[142][143] To Davis and other writers, the tensions between African-Americans and Korean-Americans had as much to do with the economic competition between the two groups caused by wider market forces as with cultural misunderstandings and Black anger about the killing of Latasha Harlins.[47]


takeaways:
-there is no place for rioting/looting. it is wrong. PERIOD. if you are somehow justifying riots/violence/looting then you are a piece of shit.
-racism against black people by police is real. it happens more often than with other races. I have stated this exists in the past. It is a bad thing and needs to change. however, it is very easy for a certain base of the left to use incidents such as these to oppress communities that are largely uninvolved, such as the Koreans during the LA Riots. They will try to oppress us, whether it is through direct violence/looting, by stealing our hard earned success through socialism, through affirmative action quotas in universities, by minority-only internships as tech firms such as google/facebook that exclude whites and asians, by portraying us negatively in liberal controlled media outlets such as (hollywood movies, netflix, ny times), by indoctrinating our youth in the education system and universities, by trying to erase student loan debt as a method of wealth redistribution, and im sure many many more devious methods.
-Asians tend to split into 2 camps in response to situations like this. According to Edward Park, the 1992 violence stimulated a new wave of political activism among Korean-Americans, but it also split them into two camps.[109][110] The liberals sought to unite with other minorities in Los Angeles to fight against racial oppression and scapegoating. The conservatives emphasized law and order and generally favored the economic and social policies of the Republican Party. The conservatives tended to emphasize the differences between Koreans and other minorities, specifically African Americans. But please make sure you understand. These people DO NOT care about you. Do not be fooled. Do not give in to the evil plans of the leftists/socialists.

also wanted to post this haha.

There are no good right-wing meme channels, cause the ring-wing are memes themselves 99% of the time, no need to make further jokes

That's true Spitfire.

Hiems, it's the second time you use that picture, so you should probably be made aware now that this is not a picture of me. It's the actor from the movie "The Man Who Sleeps". Cool attempt though.