@#$%#$%

No way.

It is better here.

lol fml

Unfortunately there have been countless polls performed which indicate users of socialized healthcare are very satisfied with their system. Theres just no real argument against it. Theres a lot of theory that without competition the medical industry would implode, students would refuse to pursue medical careers if they wont be guaranteed a couple of Mercedes Benz in their driveway, but none of that has ever really panned out.

Anyway, you already live in a socialized country. Who pays for your police protection? Your fire department? The roads you drive on from state to state? The stop signs in your neighborhood? I doubt you volunteered to give your money for all that. Socialized capitalism is the name. We pick the best parts of other working governments and mesh it all together. There are plenty of worthy people in this country who dont deserve to die because they crashed their car and could not afford top rate health insurance. People like you seem to think anyone who cant is scum of the earth anyway and doesnt deserve medical treatment.

countless polls lol
very satisfied lol
no real argument lol
implode lol

the federal government does not pay for police protection, nor my local fire department -.-
get a clue

and in talking about volunteering
have u ever been in the military?
have you ever even been outside the United States longer than 1 month at a time?
or do you just live off someone elses polls

ppl like you that make such assumptions of me are the real narrowminded scum
if you think 1 choice is the best route I've got a nice piece of swampland I'd like to sell you

however, I did just learn something from your post
more patience and less force is needed
even when I'm attacked if I stoop to the same level and defend myself even for a second things will probably never get anywhere
you'll just continue with your narrow outlook and everyone else will tune us out also

so thank you you twit ^^

wait... are you a republican? ive seen your attacks on Obama, and i agree with almot any word you say but attacking him calling him a "socialist" is just retarded.

argh no I'm not Republican and disagreeing vehemently with this does not necessarily make one so.
Please realize what is being discussed here, watch that video of Jan Schakowsky and hear what she is promoting into an intense crowd. One nationalized healthcare taking out all private business involvement and making it overall in the hands of the federal government. I've not even mentioned Obama and before we even start to go there we must clear up some definitions to insure we are on the same page.



and



I will agree to these definitions from dictionary.com, do you agree with them Baal?
Even tho I'm not very wealthy yet, here in this issue I have to don the capitalist label as I feel that capitalism is the correct way to go in terms of market and medical productivity. I just hate donning the current capitalist hat because in alot of issues imo the federal government is wrongly involved and so in bed with many big corporations and hence a capitalist gets a bad name when it's really socialist outlooks of government necessity being involved into everything that clogs it up.

Why do you think America has set the standard in medical healthcare? I do not mean that as an arrogant question. It sure as hell isn't that an American baby is born smarter than someone born in England. I'll give you a hint, it surely isn't because of government involvement either.

Which direction do you think the democrats are going and look at things?
By things I mean, property/mortgages, auto industry, banks, healthcare.... which way are we going??
Like George Bush said, you are either with us or against us.

I'd love to say more but I think I won't be around for a bit to respond and have to go so pictures are going to have to do the rest

On May 02 2009 21:43 ToTehEastSide wrote: argh no I'm not Republican and disagreeing vehemently with this does not necessarily make one so.

who did you vote for the last 3 elections?

btw, regarding taxes, inflation, bailouts, etc etc. You do remember when are in some sort of economic crisis right? You didnt expect business to just go on as usual did you? It's not our current administration's desire to completely change the game. But the country is kinda in limbo at the moment, so they are pulling out all the stops to try and rectify the issue. Then we can go back to a more familiar style of capitalism.

Why do you think America has set the standard in medical healthcare?

lol ?
lololololol

Nice level

stopping in, not home

On May 02 2009 23:25 boblion wrote: Show nested quote + Why do you think America has set the standard in medical healthcare? lol ? lololololol Nice level

ugh, this is a touchy and hard thing you point at
I have to admit I was multitasking pretty hard in my reply to baal and I knew when I posted there was some things not said clearly enough and said more so in a rush; which probably isn't the wisest thing to do on such a big issue as healthcare

but I will stand by my intended point that when spoken in general terms, most of the top medical centers on average are found in the United States.

now if we talk about healthcare distribution per individual of one country in comparison to USA and/or the distribution of that care to individuals etc etc... this is a very different statement and I guess one that coulda been drawn from what I said and I am by no means saying that here in the USA our system is superb in this fashion. My fault for implying it that way.
Things are way to corrupt and it's going to get even worse

Dude Newb the line of crap you've been sold is just incredible
or you are an absolute pro at knowing exactly what the mainstream media is telling the uneducated public and are perfectly leveling me
I mean this...

On May 02 2009 23:24 NewbSaibot wrote: btw, regarding taxes, inflation, bailouts, etc etc. You do remember when are in some sort of economic crisis right? You didnt expect business to just go on as usual did you? It's not our current administration's desire to completely change the game. But the country is kinda in limbo at the moment, so they are pulling out all the stops to try and rectify the issue. Then we can go back to a more familiar style of capitalism.

*whistles*

You do realize all those l33t conservative news sources you have are just as mainstream as anything anyone else listens to.

On May 03 2009 01:07 ToTehEastSide wrote: the federal government does not pay for police protection, nor my local fire department -.- get a clue

No, but your local state gov't does. And the federal gov't does pay for the transportation infrastructure in our country, along with the military and space program, which are responsible for 90% of shit the population uses. But you dont object to any of these do you. Oh no, the army gets a free pass on socialized services provided by the government.

Btw, just googling peoples perceptions of socialized healthcare in modern societies yields innumerable positive results. Far more than any potential naysayers, whom are undoubtedly backed by various bias or conflicts of interest.

On May 03 2009 01:00 ToTehEastSide wrote: stopping in, not home Show nested quote + On May 02 2009 23:25 boblion wrote:   Why do you think America has set the standard in medical healthcare? lol ? lololololol Nice level ugh, this is a touchy and hard thing you point at I have to admit I was multitasking pretty hard in my reply to baal and I knew when I posted there was some things not said clearly enough and said more so in a rush; which probably isn't the wisest thing to do on such a big issue as healthcare but I will stand by my intended point that when spoken in general terms, most of the top medical centers on average are found in the United States. now if we talk about healthcare distribution per individual of one country in comparison to USA and/or the distribution of that care to individuals etc etc... this is a very different statement and I guess one that coulda been drawn from what I said and I am by no means saying that here in the USA our system is superb in this fashion. My fault for implying it that way. Things are way to corrupt and it's going to get even worse

I agree. You will find most of the best medical centers in the US but for the average people they are way too expensive.

i pretty much agree with toteheastside on this, and that's saying something

As a US citizen I use the America healthcare system. Im not gonna lie, it's great. Hospitals are all very well equipped, very clean, very modern, highly skilled staff, all that latest technology, etc etc. Aside from the billions the insurance agencies skim off the top to afford CEO mansions and 100ft yachts, the money is well spent. But I can only afford this luxury because my employer pays for it. This is a rather common occurrence in our country, most people with any kind of salaried job usually have their health insurance covered, or a significant portion of it making it affordable to cover the rest. But then you have someone like my girlfriend, a law student in her senior year, who has no health insurance whatsoever. She is too old to be on her family's existing insurance, and they cant afford to foot the bill for her. She lives with me, and we split bills. Working a part time job she cannot afford to do this and cover herself. Now she isnt some high school dropout, or bugger flipper or minimum wage worker. She is a senior LAW student, whos ambition it is of course to become a lawyer. Once she accomplishes this goal insurance should be no problem for her. But what is she supposed to do until then? Go fuck herself should something unfortunate happen? Drop out after mounting medical bills forbid her from affording an education because she fell down the stairs? She doesnt deserve this. She isnt some leach who will never contribute to society. By all means, she is a prime candidate of someone who deserves insurance. What a tragedy it would be to have her life wasted if she were to fall ill and be unable to recover. What a waste of human life to just let someone like that go down the drain over something as trivial as healthcare, with beautifully well equipped hospitals surrounding us, fully able to heal her completely.

She is not the only one in this situation. It's just bullshit to let people suffer and die and fail to fulfill their capabilities when it would be so easy to help them out. Even if the influx in demand on our healthcare system no longer allowed for such luxuries, its not going to fall apart. This is obvious because it has been an astounding success in every nation that has tried it. If they can do it, quite simply so can we.

in short I agree but the answer is not to completely kill the current system and implement OUR federal government to completely 100% handle the issue of health care.
That is jumping out of the toxic pit directly into the fire

So much focus on this debate is on coverage. Having someone else to pay the bill. This does nothing to control the actual cost, and in fact if everyone is covered, there will be no limit to the cost. Insurance is the cause of the problem not the solution. Health care costs aren't what they are because of those who can't afford to pay, it's because so many have insurance to pay for them. I'm not advocating eliminating insurance, but making it mandatory only makes the problem worse.

And for those advocating a single payer system, please. If you think your HMO is screwball, wait until it's government deciding for you. The limits and restrictions HMOs have are necessary evils, and if/when the federal government becomes your HMO, these evils will still be there, in spades.

A more practical solution, but one that has no political vehicle, no industry money to lobby with, is for an increase in local clinics, with funding aid from the government, where the poor and uninsured can seek treatment. They were abundant in the 70's and completely non existing today.

The problem with American politics is the way the debate is framed. It's all driven by money, and the politicians are into the process, not looking for solutions to the problems. The solution is to have a high turn-over rate for politicians who don't produce results. Having entrenched politicians with life long careers is no good. Toss em out, new blood comes in. Toss them out if they don't produce, so that they recognize that a smile and a slogan is not enough to get them re-hired.